Steve Yegge Quits, Saying Google Is 100% Competitor Focused • Hacker News Board

Re: Steve Yegge Quits, Saying Google Is 100% Competitor Focused

#51

Post by ajeet_dhaliwal » Wed, Jan 24, 2018, 11:35 PM UTC

sushisource wrote: post #18

I do find the irony of him jumping ship to a company that's copying other ride sharing companies pretty hysterical given his complaint. Not to say that invalidates what he's saying or anything but it's a little humorous.

I only knew about him from his posts about interviewing and technical interviews and in addition to the irony you point out I wonder whether there's more irony around the possibility it could be the hiring practices he seems ok with that may also be shutting the potential innovators out. I've worked at tech companies and I feel there's a bit of a mono culture among many programmers.

Re: Steve Yegge Quits, Saying Google Is 100% Competitor Focused

#52

Post by jmadler » Wed, Jan 24, 2018, 11:39 PM UTC

I'm not sure I agree with Steve that Google is 100% competitor focused. Yes, there are lots of fast-follows, but the fast-follows are innovative (such as Google Home), and the PM teams definitely focus more on user research than on competitive research. I mean, Google didn't exactly invent the Search Engine...

I do however believe that it is increasingly difficult at Google to enter new markets as an individual contributor. Nearly all new products require executive support before they can be meaningfully commenced. There are definitely increasingly strict controls on any public releases (even silent ones) centered around protecting the Google brand.

It kinda seems like Yegge was ready to move on and created post-hoc rationalization for it that was too broadly sweeping.

I also don't think the fetishization around innovation is really that useful. It's an ill-defined and abused buzzword.

Re: Steve Yegge Quits, Saying Google Is 100% Competitor Focused

#53

Post by harlanji » Wed, Jan 24, 2018, 11:43 PM UTC

shawn wrote: post #44

Hello. I noticed Steve is writing a book about his time at Google: I have a lot of good stories saved up that I’d love to share. Google corporate didn’t much care for my blogging, and even though they never outright forbade it, I received a lot of indirect pressure from various VPs. So eventually I stopped. Sad. But that’s not where my mind’s at today. Those stories will have to wait for my book. I can completely rel…

Why is it scary? Rejection from some hypothetical group that obviously doesn't share your values? Nobody wants to close doors, but that mindset closes the only worthwhile doors anyway. Not saying make a priority, but consider where that fear is coming from. No doubt you have programming that makes pain centers activate from your writing.

Re: Steve Yegge Quits, Saying Google Is 100% Competitor Focused

#54

Post by booleandilemma » Wed, Jan 24, 2018, 11:53 PM UTC

andrewstuart wrote: post #12

The question is, where IS the innovation? Which big companies are doing an impressive job of innovating? Remember when Tim Cook was criticised for not constantly bringing out new product lines? Yo don't hear that any more - people seem to have forgotten about the idea that Apple might be a company that actually comes up with entirely new product categories. Indeed Apple hardly even releases updates to its computers a…

My company recently hired a chief innovation officer. I’m still not sure what he does but when he decides to come to the office he always wears a suit and I’m sure he’s pulling in a six-figure salary.

Re: Steve Yegge Quits, Saying Google Is 100% Competitor Focused

#55

Post by robotresearcher » Wed, Jan 24, 2018, 11:53 PM UTC

andrewstuart wrote: post #12

The question is, where IS the innovation? Which big companies are doing an impressive job of innovating? Remember when Tim Cook was criticised for not constantly bringing out new product lines? Yo don't hear that any more - people seem to have forgotten about the idea that Apple might be a company that actually comes up with entirely new product categories. Indeed Apple hardly even releases updates to its computers a…

> for example the Mac Mini was last updated 4 years ago in 2014.

For another example the iMac Pro was released a couple of weeks ago. I know what you mean, but your single example is misleading.

Re: Steve Yegge Quits, Saying Google Is 100% Competitor Focused

#56

Post by icelancer » Thu, Jan 25, 2018, 12:07 AM UTC

andrewstuart wrote: post #12

The question is, where IS the innovation? Which big companies are doing an impressive job of innovating? Remember when Tim Cook was criticised for not constantly bringing out new product lines? Yo don't hear that any more - people seem to have forgotten about the idea that Apple might be a company that actually comes up with entirely new product categories. Indeed Apple hardly even releases updates to its computers a…

SpaceX?

Re: Steve Yegge Quits, Saying Google Is 100% Competitor Focused

#57

Post by bogomipz » Thu, Jan 25, 2018, 12:07 AM UTC

>"He wrote this new blog post after deciding to join the Southeast Asian ride-hailing company Grab"

Grab is a ride-haling app that is identical to Uber and Lyft. Where is their innovation exactly? And Grab is obsessed with their competitors Go-Jek and Uber.

Re: Steve Yegge Quits, Saying Google Is 100% Competitor Focused

#58

Post by eligundry » Thu, Jan 25, 2018, 12:08 AM UTC

This is a perfect time to re-read his rant about Google vs Amazon and dogfooding.

https://plus.google.com/+RipRowan/posts/eVeouesvaVX

Re: Steve Yegge Quits, Saying Google Is 100% Competitor Focused

#59

Post by falcolas » Thu, Jan 25, 2018, 12:08 AM UTC

ztjio wrote: post #39

redleggedfrog wrote: post #38

Holy crap, that has got to be some tasty Kool-Aid. Reading the blog post, it seems curious to me that much of what his startup is predicted on is lack of any kind of governmental oversight, standards, and enforcement. It actually seems to be more taking advantage of an undesirable 3rd world situation than improving it.

So ... exactly like Uber in the beginning. Seems reasonable from a business standpoint given the historical precedent there then.

But not a very ethical one, or one with great long-term stability.

As much as I respect some of Steve Yegge's writing, there's some serious delusion/justification that seems to be going on. "[...] people are generally pretty clever about optimizing their income" is flat out wrong, and to base your view of the morality of an industry on such shaky foundations is a recipe for a rude awakening.

People work for Uber because it's a job. Not necessarily because it's a well paying job or a job with anything resembling a future, but it's an easy-to-obtain job.

Re: Steve Yegge Quits, Saying Google Is 100% Competitor Focused

#60

Post by old-gregg » Thu, Jan 25, 2018, 12:08 AM UTC

ken wrote: post #40

andrewstuart wrote: post #12

The question is, where IS the innovation? Which big companies are doing an impressive job of innovating? Remember when Tim Cook was criticised for not constantly bringing out new product lines? Yo don't hear that any more - people seem to have forgotten about the idea that Apple might be a company that actually comes up with entirely new product categories. Indeed Apple hardly even releases updates to its computers a…

I think the Google Maps analysis ("Google Maps's Moat"), a month ago, showed some pretty innovative work happening at Google! But more generally, I think this highlights a fundamental problem with how systems are built and sold. JWZ once described a "Cascade of Attention-Deficit Teenagers" model of software development, where you get bored with the old codebase and just throw it out, only to make just as many mistake…

Are there any successful examples of an open source projects integrating with Google's OAuth2? We're thinking about adding OAuth2 support for Google Apps to Teleport [1] and would be nice to see a widely adopted solution which people are happy about, open source or not.

[1] https://teleport.sh