Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Cape Town could be the first city to run out of water

bbc.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

51–60 of 147 posts

Re: Cape Town could be the first city to run out of water

#51

Post by tonteldoos »

I'm currently in Brisbane, and arrived here while the big drought was still in progress (around 2008). Numerous restrictions, legislation for water saving measures, desal plants, etc were being implemented at the time, with pretty astounding results in terms of average water consumption.

The drought broke in January 2011, and it's a little sad to see how much that was learnt, has been forgotten in the last 7 years. Desal plants all but mothballed, average consumption gone up (almost double the drought levels again), etc. I really hope the drought in Cape Town breaks soon (I have many friends there), but I hope they don't unlearn the lessons, and kill infrastructure when it does.

Interestingly, late last year, it was pointed out by the authorities that the dams are at warning (pre restriction) levels again here, so I dare say we will see it all again.

Re: Cape Town could be the first city to run out of water

#52

Post by ti_ranger »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #41
sgt wrote: post #7

It's definitely a big problem, yet I see a lot of creative solutions which gives us a bit of hope for the future. People are also working together to keep water consumption at its lowest. A lot of people are gathering rain water with big water tanks next to their houses. I've personally built a setup connected to the gutters of my roof, and it's amazing how much water you can gather like this. It's also quite easy to…

A pool must use a lot of water - perhaps heavy taxation on [water for] pools would help in the future?

It's been illegal to use municipal water in pools for a few months now. Most municipal swimming pools are closed.

Before that (around March 2017), you were only allowed to do so if you had a 'pool blanket', which makes a huge difference.

(The little amount of rain we have received over the past few weeks is sufficient to keep the levels high enough in our pool to keep the water level above the weir, without having used other water)

Re: Cape Town could be the first city to run out of water

#53

Post by tonteldoos »

baxtr wrote: post #47
whatusername wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And it’s bigger in area than any two European countries (excluding Russia) combined. Just because there’s a drought in one part of Spain __ there might be plenty of water somewhere in France.

My point is: if there’s a case to fly water (in form of grapes) to Europe, why would they not move water from one place in SA to another?

Cost and lead time of infrastructure (and adequate planning).

Systems to do this exist in the country (eg, moving water from Lesotho to the Vaaldam with the Highlands water scheme), but that project was 15+ years in the making, and is still ongoing.

From what I can see, nothing like this was realistically expected for Cape Town, and thus never planned for.

Re: Cape Town could be the first city to run out of water

#54

Post by PeterisP »

yoz-y wrote: post #17
pjc50 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why did you think that?

I would guess rising seas. Water gets closer to you, literally.

Water supplies implicitly mean freshwater supplies. Sea level rising can't help that (seawater is not usable directly, and for desalination plants the bottleneck is their capacity and power usage, not amount of seawater available) but it can make it worse e.g. if certain aquifers become saltwater.

Re: Cape Town could be the first city to run out of water

#55

Post by crankylinuxuser »

spodek wrote: post #43

Just finished reading Affluence Without Abundance https://www.amazon.com/Affluence-Without-Abundance-Disappear... about bushmen who live in southern Africa. It turns out people have lived in southern Africa for 200,000 years , hunting and gathering. Westerners show up, run out of water in a couple hundred years, and call them "developing." The book is an eye-opener.

Yes, but hunting and gathering in the bush doesn't do a damn about increasing technology and getting us off this planet. All it takes is one planetary scale disaster, and we're done for.

Re: Cape Town could be the first city to run out of water

#56

Post by buyx »

baxtr wrote: post #47
whatusername wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And it’s bigger in area than any two European countries (excluding Russia) combined. Just because there’s a drought in one part of Spain __ there might be plenty of water somewhere in France.

My point is: if there’s a case to fly water (in form of grapes) to Europe, why would they not move water from one place in SA to another?

why would they not move water from one place in SA to another

Not my area of expertise, but:

South Africa has some massive water transfer schemes: The Lesotho Highlands Water Project and others. The Western Cape Province and Cape Town are governed by the national opposition party (Democratic Alliance). It wouldn't surprise me if this led to a lack of coordination and plannning with the national government, if not outright neglect of the issue (along with general infrastructure-planning neglect between 1990-2005 or so).

Re: Cape Town could be the first city to run out of water

#57

Post by boet »

Feniks wrote: post #49

Amusing since Cape Town was founded by the Dutch as a place to resupply for the long voyage to the Spice Islands. Including clean drinking water.

Since the communist ANC took over from the NP, the whole country went downhill. This would have never happened if there was a white man in charge of the infrastructure. Unfortunately anti white racial laws kicked out most competent people from these positions.

This comment will most likely be blocked. Truth hurts sometimes. We Afrikaners (Dutch) are being forgotten..

Re: Cape Town could be the first city to run out of water

#58

Post by ImSkeptical »

badosu wrote: post #34
charlesdm wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, that's interesting. Are there companies that own water capacity in countries? Might be a good long term investment.

Not sure how to interpret this statement.. One part of me is disgusted at someone profiting from bad planning and misery of others, the other thinks that this is something that really needs investing.

This is the great strength of capitalism. We might hear about the plot of South African and mourn their descent into dehydration as a dark future that awaits many. Or, the capitalists among us might realize that there is money to be made in providing water, and thereby resources are allocated to providing water, and that dark future is (hopefully) prevented.

Re: Cape Town could be the first city to run out of water

#59

Post by pathseeker »

pjc50 wrote: post #44
charlesdm wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I meant this in a positive, not negative way. A for-profit company, if done properly, will be able to introduce the required infrastructure where necessary. It should (theoretically at least) also be run in a better way -- if the infrastructure isn't functioning properly, no profits are being made.

"if done properly", state infrastructure can do this just as well. I'd have a look at the Carillion bankruptcy before claiming that the private sector is a solution.

The problem is that state's aren't really motivated to get things done in a cost efficient manner. If the government in SA is like the US, employees are not rewarded for doing anything beyond the bare minimum to prove that they are still alive. In a private business, the employees have to help the business towards its goal of making money, so all of the incentives are aligned to be successful (employees want promotions and not to get fired, the investors don't want to lose money).

Re: Cape Town could be the first city to run out of water

#60

Post by 20after4 »

SolarNet wrote: post #40
yoz-y wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would guess rising seas. Water gets closer to you, literally.

Have you ever tried drinking sea water? It tastes salty. The short of it being: It makes you thirstier; drinking it is worse than drinking nothing. Desalination is expensive in many ways. If it was a viable way of acquiring water (which it is in some places, like literal deserts) then these places would have already done it. Hence rising sea levels provide no additional access drinkable water.

But it has what plants crave.
Post reply on HN