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Big tech is built on predatory pricing

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Re: Big tech is built on predatory pricing

#51

Post by stale2002 »

habosa wrote: post #2

What Uber is doing here should absolutely not be allowed. Whenever you go to a city where Uber is in it's first year of operations the prices are insanely low. This also happens when Uber launches a new product like Pool. This enables them to crowd out any competition and then raise prices once they've got control of the market. I have a friend in SF who takes Uber to work every day. It's about 3.5 miles. I assumed h…

Ok, maybe it hurts competitors, but how in the world does it mess with public transportation?

Public transportation can't handle the load across the country. If everyone starts using VC subsidized services, that FIXES the public transportation under capacity problem.

Public transportation loses money. So if people find something better or cheaper, then all the better!

Re: Big tech is built on predatory pricing

#52

Post by dingo_bat »

habosa wrote: post #2

What Uber is doing here should absolutely not be allowed. Whenever you go to a city where Uber is in it's first year of operations the prices are insanely low. This also happens when Uber launches a new product like Pool. This enables them to crowd out any competition and then raise prices once they've got control of the market. I have a friend in SF who takes Uber to work every day. It's about 3.5 miles. I assumed h…

I am very happy. Uber has saved me from buying a car for 2-3 years now. Honestly this is the best time for consumers.

Re: Big tech is built on predatory pricing

#53

Post by dingo_bat »

pfarnsworth wrote: post #32
skybrian wrote: post #14

This analysis seems pretty shallow. It's interesting that Amazon is losing money in North America. But why? That's clue worth investigating further, not a reason to immediately assume predatory pricing.

Amazon mainly operates in North America. They are not nearly as big in other continents as they are in the US/Canada.

Dunno about other places but they are huge in India. Almost everybody I know buys from Amazon and has a prime subscription.

Re: Big tech is built on predatory pricing

#54

Post by bryanrasmussen »

the thing is, will it work. I can understand it has worked in the past but it seems to me in the case of Amazon, it seems they've been doing this for more than a decade and it hasn't seemed to work yet in that they are not yet at the level where they can raise their prices.

The same with Uber, will they ever really kill off Lyft, local taxi services (especially with local government fighting them doing so) and public transit, as well as the other competitors springing up. It seems like a massive transfer of VC wealth to the public without a really well thought out plan as to when and how they will be in a position that they can securely raise the prices. I think they will never be able to. That a tactic has worked in some industries and situations does not mean it will work in every situation. I mean where I live there are other, non-Uber services that allow you to easily pick up cars sitting around the city by using your app to get into them. These are also competitors. Self driving cars might allow them to cut costs, but these will also allow others to compete on other services. In short, I think the VCs who dream of Uber someday gouging their customers are deluded, and the same for Bezos - if that day was ever gonna come it would have come some time ago.

Re: Big tech is built on predatory pricing

#55

Post by secabeen »

jakob223 wrote: post #37
habosa wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Edit: "Express POOL is a new kind of shared ride that begins and ends at convenient Express spots. Update your app today to start riding for as low as $2.” It's not Uber Pool it's some new product I hadn't heard of before he mentioned it. Shared ride with a fixed pickup point. I see the same pricing you see when I use Uber/Lyft.

ergh why are we reinventing buses as an app

One factor is the reputation/blacklist system. If you are harrassed on a bus, you don't have much recourse. Sure, you can complain to the metro police, but all they can do is take a report. On a shared ride like this, Uber/Lyft can increment the "harassment complaint" counter of all of the other riders with you. A regular harasser will quickly add up multiple complaints, and will be banned from the system.

Honestly, the biggest change brought by Uber, AirBNB, etc. is the reputation and recourse systems. They have brought a lot of accountability to systems that historically were low on them on both sides. The newly-found accountability allowed a lot of new entrants to these markets that weren't saddled with the high levels of process that had been used in the past to impose even a little accountability on these services.

Re: Big tech is built on predatory pricing

#56

Post by TheDong »

nicolewhite wrote: post #46
habosa wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agree. But since the bus in SF is $2.50 I can see why my friend takes the Uber.

The Uber is also safer, cleaner, and more reliable.

I highly doubt that "safer" is correct; on average, buses have fewer deaths per km traveled.

Uber drivers are generally decent drivers, but they're still not as well trained as bus drivers, they're more likely to be distracted by e.g. fiddling with the uber or map apps on their phone.

Unless you have numbers specifically about uber's fleet being significantly safer than typical drivers, your claim goes against the results of recent studies finding busses and rails safer than cars.

Re: Big tech is built on predatory pricing

#57

Post by TheDong »

stale2002 wrote: post #51
habosa wrote: post #2

What Uber is doing here should absolutely not be allowed. Whenever you go to a city where Uber is in it's first year of operations the prices are insanely low. This also happens when Uber launches a new product like Pool. This enables them to crowd out any competition and then raise prices once they've got control of the market. I have a friend in SF who takes Uber to work every day. It's about 3.5 miles. I assumed h…

Ok, maybe it hurts competitors, but how in the world does it mess with public transportation? Public transportation can't handle the load across the country. If everyone starts using VC subsidized services, that FIXES the public transportation under capacity problem. Public transportation loses money. So if people find something better or cheaper, then all the better!

> Ok, maybe it hurts competitors, but how in the world does it mess with public transportation? ... If everyone starts using VC subsidized services...

If no one uses public transit, public transit will be hurt clearly.

The real risk though is that people who can afford uber start using it, public transit fails, and then uber increases its price since people have fewer options.

> Public transportation loses money. So

Public transit loses money in a narrow view of things. In the grand scheme though, it's paid for by tax dollars and is for the good of the public.

There have been a few studies that show accessible public transit is a huge factor in benefiting the poor[0].

The fact that it's subsidized by taxes (and thus moreso by the rich than the poor) is part of the reason it can benefit those people who aren't so well off.

If a VC subsidized service takes over, well, VC subsidization is a far less sustainable method of providing for the poor than taxes.

0: https://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/07/upshot/transportation-eme...

Re: Big tech is built on predatory pricing

#58

Post by zokeia »

dingo_bat wrote: post #53
pfarnsworth wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazon mainly operates in North America. They are not nearly as big in other continents as they are in the US/Canada.

Dunno about other places but they are huge in India. Almost everybody I know buys from Amazon and has a prime subscription.

Highly doubt you or your acquaintances represent the average Indian.

Re: Big tech is built on predatory pricing

#59

Post by dingo_bat »

zokeia wrote: post #58
dingo_bat wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dunno about other places but they are huge in India. Almost everybody I know buys from Amazon and has a prime subscription.

Highly doubt you or your acquaintances represent the average Indian.

Even if they don't, Amazon's still huge here. According to my annual income, I am in the top 0.2% of Indians, but there are 13 million Indians who earn more than me. I bet at least they are using Amazon as much as me and my friends.

Used this calculator: http://www.thehindu.com/data/how-many-indians-are-richer-tha...

Re: Big tech is built on predatory pricing

#60

Post by zaarn »

secabeen wrote: post #55
jakob223 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ergh why are we reinventing buses as an app

One factor is the reputation/blacklist system. If you are harrassed on a bus, you don't have much recourse. Sure, you can complain to the metro police, but all they can do is take a report. On a shared ride like this, Uber/Lyft can increment the "harassment complaint" counter of all of the other riders with you. A regular harasser will quickly add up multiple complaints, and will be banned from the system. Honestly,…

> If you are harrassed on a bus, you don't have much recourse. Sure, you can complain to the metro police, but all they can do is take a report.

Not my experience really. I've filed at least two successful reports of harassment with local police and one complaint against a bus driver at the responsible bus organization.

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