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How Facebook’s Oracular Algorithm Determines the Fates of Startups

nytimes.com

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Re: How Facebook’s Oracular Algorithm Determines the Fates of Startups

#51

Post by maksimum »

daveid wrote: post #42

About a year ago I wrote an essay with this idea [1]. You really don't want your company to be at the behest of facebook/twitter, they can pull the plug on you, change their algorithms, change their rules, force you to pay up, since they control the audience. This is why a platform like Mastodon [2] is attractive (or should be attractive!) to businesses. If you host your own instance of Mastodon, you have full contro…

There are many pros to a de-centralized and self-governing social network. The con is the network effect working against it. So in whose interest is it to push this network? You argued that businesses should, because Facebook might cut them off in the future. But in the now Mastodon doesn't have customers. Individuals may not like what Facebook is doing with their data, but inconvenience is hard to sell. I'm genuinely curious how people think adoption of decentralized social networks can be accelerated?

Re: How Facebook’s Oracular Algorithm Determines the Fates of Startups

#52

Post by empath75 »

daveid wrote: post #42

About a year ago I wrote an essay with this idea [1]. You really don't want your company to be at the behest of facebook/twitter, they can pull the plug on you, change their algorithms, change their rules, force you to pay up, since they control the audience. This is why a platform like Mastodon [2] is attractive (or should be attractive!) to businesses. If you host your own instance of Mastodon, you have full contro…

Why would I advertise on a platform that has no users?

Re: How Facebook’s Oracular Algorithm Determines the Fates of Startups

#53

Post by traek »

nihonde wrote: post #47
matsur wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People entering and converting through a purchase funnel?

OK, so how is the success of that funnel measured vis-a-vis other promotional channels? And are you able to demonstrate definitively that a visitor from FB concluded a sale? If so, how?

> OK, so how is the success of that funnel measured vis-a-vis other promotional channels?

What difference does it make? If it’s profitable, it’s profitable.

> And are you able to demonstrate definitively that a visitor from FB concluded a sale? If so, how?

Through the variety of existing measurement solutions, or a custom solution.

Twitter: https://business.twitter.com/en/help/campaign-measurement-an...

Facebook: https://developers.facebook.com/docs/facebook-pixel/pixel-wi...

Google: https://support.google.com/adwords/answer/1722054?hl=en

I don’t understand why you seem to think that companies are throwing tens of billions of dollars a year at Facebook (and Google, and Twitter) with not only no returns but also no ability to measure that lack of returns. It’s just such a ridiculous viewpoint to hold.

Re: How Facebook’s Oracular Algorithm Determines the Fates of Startups

#54

Post by jmgrosen »

JoshMnem wrote: post #49
flashman wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Facebook will also now know you visited a store based on a new feature that matches GPS, beacons, WiFi, radio signals, and cell towers with brick-and-mortar coordinates." [1] Basically harvesting data from your phone's sensors, where their app is installed. And: "A new Facebook API, called the Offline Conversions API, works with a number of in-store sales systems from companies like Square and IBM to match their cus…

That's terrible. I hope that removing all of Facebook's software from a phone and using cash prevents that. I hope you're joking about the audio signal.

Not quite used for in-store advertising, but Google's "Nearby Messages API" does use "near-ultrasound" audio signals to communicate with other devices: https://developers.google.com/nearby/messages/overview. I don't know if it would work at a larger scale, though (maybe you couldn't allow dogs in your store!).

Re: How Facebook’s Oracular Algorithm Determines the Fates of Startups

#55

Post by dingo_bat »

ballenf wrote: post #8

How Facebook determines ad placement in news feeds: > Millions of auctions take place every minute as users across Facebook load their feeds. ... The algorithm is constantly learning, using past results to inform how it weighs bids in the next auction. The intent, Facebook says, is to maximize value for everybody: to pair the advertiser with its likeliest customers, and to show ads that users want to see . And, of co…

I wonder where we'd be today if all this effort was focused on something like automatic cars. Instead of spam.

Re: How Facebook’s Oracular Algorithm Determines the Fates of Startups

#56

Post by egypturnash »

daveid wrote: post #42

About a year ago I wrote an essay with this idea [1]. You really don't want your company to be at the behest of facebook/twitter, they can pull the plug on you, change their algorithms, change their rules, force you to pay up, since they control the audience. This is why a platform like Mastodon [2] is attractive (or should be attractive!) to businesses. If you host your own instance of Mastodon, you have full contro…

Of course, other instance owners may choose to block you for being A Brand, as well. One of the rules of my instance is "don’t be a corporation, or be sponsored by one", and I'm debating if I’d end up blocking corporate instances.

Re: How Facebook’s Oracular Algorithm Determines the Fates of Startups

#57

Post by jaggederest »

nihonde wrote: post #46
akanet wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, this is a very strange statement. Many businesses are printing money advertising through Facebook.

Then you should be able to answer my question: what is the metric for ROI?

Return on investment for advertising is very simple:

net present average customer lifetime value acquired per unit of advertising cost

If it's over unity, you're making money with advertising, if it's not, you're wasting money on advertising or need to increase your CLTV or decrease your discount rate.

Re: How Facebook’s Oracular Algorithm Determines the Fates of Startups

#58

Post by jaggederest »

nihonde wrote: post #47
matsur wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People entering and converting through a purchase funnel?

OK, so how is the success of that funnel measured vis-a-vis other promotional channels? And are you able to demonstrate definitively that a visitor from FB concluded a sale? If so, how?

Yes. Facebook gives you a unique visitor id when they see the ad that persists and is included in the sale form. It's completely linear, and is tracked from beginning to end. Every click is tracked, and users are tracked even if they leave the website and return later.

There's hard, direct evidence involved in every step of the way.

Re: How Facebook’s Oracular Algorithm Determines the Fates of Startups

#59

Post by nl »

nihonde wrote: post #47
matsur wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People entering and converting through a purchase funnel?

OK, so how is the success of that funnel measured vis-a-vis other promotional channels? And are you able to demonstrate definitively that a visitor from FB concluded a sale? If so, how?

OK, so how is the success of that funnel measured vis-a-vis other promotional channels?

It's trivial easy to add a tracking id to this (in-fact I think it is on by default)

And are you able to demonstrate definitively that a visitor from FB concluded a sale? If so, how?

I think people are a little confused about if you are trolling or you genuinely don't know.

Anyway, https://developers.facebook.com/docs/facebook-pixel/pixel-wi... (and plenty of other methods)

It's really, really easy. And that is why Facebook and Google are printing money - vendors know it works and can measure exactly how well, so they throw money at them.

Re: How Facebook’s Oracular Algorithm Determines the Fates of Startups

#60

Post by nihonde »

jaggederest wrote: post #57
nihonde wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then you should be able to answer my question: what is the metric for ROI?

Return on investment for advertising is very simple: net present average customer lifetime value acquired per unit of advertising cost If it's over unity, you're making money with advertising, if it's not, you're wasting money on advertising or need to increase your CLTV or decrease your discount rate.

How do you measure this? Please be specific.
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