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Books from 1923 to 1941 Now Liberated

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Re: Books from 1923 to 1941 Now Liberated

#51

Post by toomuchtodo »

orblivion wrote: post #50
toomuchtodo wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Archive.org can take and provide works that are still under copyright due to library provisions in the DMCA. Project Gutenberg only provides public domain works, but on a per country basis: https://www.gutenberg.org/wiki/Gutenberg:Copyright_FAQ#Copyr... (some works are in the public domain in Australia, but not yet in the US, for example)

> library provisions in the DMCA There's stuff about archive.org I still don't quite understand. So they use legal hacks to host all the stuff they do? They're legally a library or something?

The Internet Archive is fully compliant with the DMCA's safe harbor provisions; in the event an item is reported by a copyright owner, it will no longer be served to the public (but it will remain in storage until a later date).

Re: Books from 1923 to 1941 Now Liberated

#52

Post by justin66 »

Rebelgecko wrote: post #33
sitkack wrote: post #12

> Sonny Bono Memorial Collection Heh.

Although the article's claim that he represented part of Los Angeles in Congress is kind of a stretch (unless they're being snidely metaphorical and it went over my head)

Metaphorical no, snide yes. Lookup the Sonny Bono Copyright Term Extension Act.

Re: Books from 1923 to 1941 Now Liberated

#53

Post by winstonewert »

maskedSlacker wrote: post #35
Jesus_Jones wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are plenty of poor places with people starving, even though we have enough food to give it to people. But even in the usa, there are people who don't get enough to eat. in Seattle I often see news stories about the food bank.

But that's not caused by SCARCITY. Scarcity means there isn't enough food. That's not the problem we have. There is enough food to feed everyone. It's just owned by the wrong people.

Scarcity in economics doesn't mean "not enough" right now, it means that if it were free there wouldn't be enough. If food were free, production would drop sharply and most of would starve.

Re: Books from 1923 to 1941 Now Liberated

#54

Post by zanny »

dhimes wrote: post #25
c3534l wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All copyright prohibitions are "fake." In our current society, all supply shortages of media are artificial.

The interesting question here is, are the shortages necessary to have high quality media? I would love to have an HN-filtered list of reading on the arguments- both sides. I personally only have an ill-informed, therefore worthless, opinion.

I get most of my entertainment nowadays from artists (musical, artistic, etc) that I fund on Patreon, via Paypal, or on Kickstarters.

So... no. Not at all.

The reason we are not seeing 150M budget movies coming out of crowdfunding is that right now the market is too small. Its a fledgling industry to directly patronize your entertainers without the profit seeking middleman in between (or at least in the case of Patreon et al that middle man is minimized). As it grows projects like the Blender Open Movie project or all the software being crowdfunded will become more common and more culturally accepted.

On top of that, there is very little organization in crowdfunding right now. Almost exclusively because of the newness of it all - it is untested, and for anyone who is just making a living off patronage now taking a huge risk partnering with other artists to combine efforts to make more complicated media is a huge gamble.

That being said, there are no logistical barriers to it. It is only a matter of time. But for patronage models to take over media production - which they will inevitably do, on the simple premise that the middle men profiteers in between creators and consumers of media only existed when the logistics of distribution required not just money but influence in the industry to even get your product blessed to be sold in limited theaters or stores and are now redundant - will require a substantial cultural shift for consumers. And those kinds of shifts take generations. I think those under 30 are fairly receptive to the idea, but to make it pervasive may require fresh minds open to the idea that need to grow with constant exposure to the concept early on.

Otherwise its just a "neat thing" rather than the cultural revolution it will need to be to finalize the model - abolishing obsoleted IP concepts alongside the cultural expectation to "put money where your mouth is" on the things you want to see made, rather than for the things that already exist and are being artificially restricted by the government.

Re: Books from 1923 to 1941 Now Liberated

#55

Post by Swizec »

stcredzero wrote: post #40
c3534l wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All copyright prohibitions are "fake." In our current society, all supply shortages of media are artificial.

In our current society, all supply shortages of media are artificial If you take supply shortages of media as being caused by a long term lack of profitable remuneration/funding for media, then there is nothing artificial about it. It's the funding model which is broken. I wish there was something like Patreon, but which would take some monthly subscription amount and automatically distribute it to the creators I lik…

> something like Patreon, but which would take some monthly subscription amount and automatically distribute it to the creators I like, in proportion to the enjoyment they've provided.

Like Spotify, radio, broadcadt TV and such? They pay artists based on airtime and they allot airtime based on viewership/listenership,

Re: Books from 1923 to 1941 Now Liberated

#56

Post by brianjoseff »

zanny wrote: post #54
dhimes wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The interesting question here is, are the shortages necessary to have high quality media? I would love to have an HN-filtered list of reading on the arguments- both sides. I personally only have an ill-informed, therefore worthless, opinion.

I get most of my entertainment nowadays from artists (musical, artistic, etc) that I fund on Patreon, via Paypal, or on Kickstarters. So... no. Not at all. The reason we are not seeing 150M budget movies coming out of crowdfunding is that right now the market is too small. Its a fledgling industry to directly patronize your entertainers without the profit seeking middleman in between (or at least in the case of Patre…

For the most part, I agree with you.

However, the profiteering middlemen do add value in that they actively curate and package content in ways that are "consumable" and desirable. They are sourcing the steady drip-feed of content that we passively consume.

Shunning passive feeds, and actively seeking out content that fits your preferences, as you do, requires effort. Any product the consumption of which requires effort is inevitably displaced by service providers who deliver said thing frictionlessly....eliminating the effort.

Agreed that there will always be a slice of the market that actively shuns passively-fed products and ascribes a priceable value to goods that don't fit that friction-eliminating model (e.g., craft beers). But, as long as we remain purely, animalistically, and perhaps irrationally susceptible to simple stimuli-- a large slice of the market will be kow-towed to frictionlessly delivered, externally curated products.

Simply put, some people don't want to go express their preferences for certain products. They just want the market to deliver them something stimulating and to a certain degree they don't care what it is.

But let's move towards your world! On balance it is better, richer, and more full of vibrant, distinctly human creativity.

Re: Books from 1923 to 1941 Now Liberated

#57

Post by dv_dt »

lotyrin wrote: post #21
jdmichal wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I really hope I get to live long enough to see society have to tackle the "oh fuck, currency as a concept is useless" problem, aka the steps leading up to post-scarcity. I would only want to see that if we were already post-scarcity. Otherwise, there's going to be a lot of bloodshed as people figure it out and realize they don't have any way to continue buying the things they require to live. Post-scarcity is great…

Globally, we are pretty much post-scarce on anything anyone "requires to live". The struggle will be to find out how all the rest gets divided when controlling distribution of the right to live is no longer a bargaining position and discovering if we can still provide for everyone without servitude.

> The struggle will be to find out how all the rest gets divided when controlling distribution of the right to live is no longer a bargaining position and discovering if we can still provide for everyone without servitude.

Yes exactly like healthcare in the US...

Re: Books from 1923 to 1941 Now Liberated

#58

Post by thaumasiotes »

stcredzero wrote: post #39
komali2 wrote: post #9

I'm ambivalent about all the weirdness about digital books. On the one hand, I kinda get why San Francisco Public Library has to "pretend" it can only loan out 20 "digital copies" of "The Subtle Art of not Giving a Fuck" at a time, because I guess if you could just instantly use the Libby app to throw it on your kindle and renew endlessly, why would anybody ever buy a book? Still, it is "fake" prohibitions. There's l…

I really hope I get to live long enough to see society have to tackle the "oh fuck, currency as a concept is useless" problem, aka the steps leading up to post-scarcity...Highly highly unlikely... Is there ever going to be a post-scarcity era, or is scarcity contextual? Perhaps it is just going to be a moving target, like AI seems to be? Once a chess playing program that could beat the world champion was a pipe dream…

> Is there ever going to be a post-scarcity era, or is scarcity contextual?

There cannot be a post-scarcity era as long as one man is able to impregnate more than one woman.

Re: Books from 1923 to 1941 Now Liberated

#59

Post by PhasmaFelis »

harry8 wrote: post #45
PhasmaFelis wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd be happy to pay more taxes to get, at the very least, better social services for those who can't support themselves. I want to live in a world that cares for those people. If you prefer a selfish motivation, I also want those services to be available for me and my loved ones, should they be needed in the future. The blocker is that I don't have the time, expertise, bargaining power, or economies of scale to effic…

Take how much extra tax you are willing to pay. Pay it to charity that best supports those ideals. If you're not already doing this people will suggest talk is cheap and posturing has a negative value to society at large. Good luck with it!

I do give to charity, actually. That hardly precludes me from wishing my money, and others', was used more efficiently.

I feel like this isn't going how you were expecting. I was supposed to be exposed as a hollow "progressive" who's free with other people's money but is secretly a grasping hypocrite. You shouldn't assume everyone is selfish just because you are.

Re: Books from 1923 to 1941 Now Liberated

#60

Post by BurningFrog »

c3534l wrote: post #16
komali2 wrote: post #9

I'm ambivalent about all the weirdness about digital books. On the one hand, I kinda get why San Francisco Public Library has to "pretend" it can only loan out 20 "digital copies" of "The Subtle Art of not Giving a Fuck" at a time, because I guess if you could just instantly use the Libby app to throw it on your kindle and renew endlessly, why would anybody ever buy a book? Still, it is "fake" prohibitions. There's l…

All copyright prohibitions are "fake." In our current society, all supply shortages of media are artificial.

True. Then again, all the protected creations are also artificial constructs.
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