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Undercover in a Toronto factory where a temp worker died

projects.thestar.com

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Re: Undercover in a Toronto factory where a temp worker died

#51

Post by RHSeeger »

frgtpsswrdlame wrote: post #43
_5ysi wrote: post #40

Having worked at two manufacturers in the Midwest, anecdotally the majority of forklift drivers, line workers on specific lines, and even many white collar office roles were filled by temp agencies. A similar structure existed for engineering too; we would have a problem and the engineering firm with workers under the same roof would develop a solution. For the temp workers the motivation was always very clear and ve…

Ending right to work laws and bringing back unions.

Of course, that too comes with it's negatives. Unions have both positives and negatives. It's not a simple discussion.

Re: Undercover in a Toronto factory where a temp worker died

#52

Post by andrewl »

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #37
andrewl wrote: post #17

This kind of article is a reminder of how much we need traditional newspapers, and what we'd lose if they went away. I sometimes read suggestions that independent bloggers will replace newspapers, but I don't think they can do everything newspaper reporters do. This reporter worked undercover for a month. There would also have been a lot of time spent on background research before she went undercover. Then it would h…

Bloggers can one-up journalists though - there's been a number of critical blog posts and articles from (former) employees at Uber, Google, etc, which eventually cost CEO's their jobs. Actually working and living the life is even better than being a journalist and having to dive into it.

I agree. A number of bloggers have definitely made contributions.

I'd be curious to know if the majority of people writing to expose abuses in their own companies are in white collar companies or companies like the bakery described in the Toronto Star. I would predict that more are in white collar companies, as they are more likely to already be aware of how to get content up on the web. Certainly employees of Uber or Google are. But I'm not aware of any research on this, so my prediction isn't backed by anything substantial.

Still, I think of people like the temp employees at this bakery as being more toward the voiceless end of the continuum, and more in need of a muckraking reporter.

Re: Undercover in a Toronto factory where a temp worker died

#53

Post by frgtpsswrdlame »

RHSeeger wrote: post #51
frgtpsswrdlame wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ending right to work laws and bringing back unions.

Of course, that too comes with it's negatives. Unions have both positives and negatives. It's not a simple discussion.

Unions are a counter-balance to corporate power which helps to preserve the power of labor. That unions have some negatives does not mean we should not have them.

Re: Undercover in a Toronto factory where a temp worker died

#54

Post by yial »

ams6110 wrote: post #47
castle-bravo wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consider getting a bread maker: Keurig for bread.

Or a mixing bowl and 15 minutes or so to hand-knead. You don't need a machine, likely also made in a factory under similar conditions, to make bread dough.

I agree. As someone who bakes bread frequently there are many recipes that don't require anything beyond ingredients , a bowl, and oven and some trays.

However, if you're really doing some serious dough, or just want to branch out. A kitchenaid mixer makes it way easier to get windowpain, and if you're all about the yeast, a food thermometer can be good.

Re: Undercover in a Toronto factory where a temp worker died

#55

Post by mcgarnagle »

frgtpsswrdlame wrote: post #43
_5ysi wrote: post #40

Having worked at two manufacturers in the Midwest, anecdotally the majority of forklift drivers, line workers on specific lines, and even many white collar office roles were filled by temp agencies. A similar structure existed for engineering too; we would have a problem and the engineering firm with workers under the same roof would develop a solution. For the temp workers the motivation was always very clear and ve…

Ending right to work laws and bringing back unions.

When the notion of a union was proposed to the management at Fierra, the owners spread the word that if the workers began forming one, everyone would be immediately fired and replaced.

source: My grandmother used to work at this very factory when we first moved to Canada. She worked for about 5-6 years, starting in the 90s.

When you are new to a country, don't speak the language or know the laws well, you don't have as much power as you think.

Re: Undercover in a Toronto factory where a temp worker died

#56

Post by chrisseaton »

toopok4k3 wrote: post #32
chrisseaton wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you hire a plumber to do a job in your home for an hour is he now your employee?

No. There are clear differences on who is responsible here. We can expect a factory to be always responsible over their area as it is a larger entity and doing business and we expect them to be experts and be in control of their own domain. We can expect them to be responsible over their non skilled labourers. A plumber is the expert in this case and he controls his domain while you are just a dumb customer.

That's why it's not simple - you've got lots of things open to debate there - who is skilled or unskilled, who is a business, who is a 'larger' entity, who is the expert. That's why it's more complicated than just saying 'yes' with an emphatic full stop.

Re: Undercover in a Toronto factory where a temp worker died

#57

Post by mcgrath_sh »

andrewl wrote: post #17

This kind of article is a reminder of how much we need traditional newspapers, and what we'd lose if they went away. I sometimes read suggestions that independent bloggers will replace newspapers, but I don't think they can do everything newspaper reporters do. This reporter worked undercover for a month. There would also have been a lot of time spent on background research before she went undercover. Then it would h…

I agree to a certain extent. I think there is an interesting gap between "independent blogger" and "traditional newspaper" that is starting to pop up in sports media and may be able to be successful in typical journalism. This site would be hyper-focused on a specific niche and would have paying customers to access content. Essentially, I think what we see in a traditional city-based newspaper will splinter into 3-5 related sites (one for a state or region that does general news and these types of investigations with smaller local arms for local news) that have paid access (either subscription or per-article pricing) of some sort. I do see some problems with that with non-sports information though.

As an aside, I'm not terribly familiar with bitcoin, but I often wondered if something like reddit's bitcoin bot was the solution to pay per article access. A system where you simply paste your wallet key into the article to unlock the rest of it for a nominal fee ($0.03-$0.08 per article) would seem to be a way to pay for things without a zillion accounts or transactions on your card. I say bitcoin, but, realistically, any universal pool of money that can be quickly withdrawn from without an account on a specific site would be neat. There have been times I wanted to read investigative articles from WSJ or other subscription sites, but I don't want to subscribe or have yet another login. If I could just paste in a code or click Apple Pay for that one article, I gladly would. The counter to that is I don't want every sub $0.50 transaction popping up on my credit card, which is why a universal pool of money like Bitcoin would be best.

I do think the idea of having time and a strong legal team behind you is important for this kind of story. Currently, the best way to access that is a traditional newspaper. Small operations definitely can't take on the legal risks for something like this, which is why an Atlantic model is difficult for hard journalism. I do wonder if independent places would start pooling resources for things like this.

Re: Undercover in a Toronto factory where a temp worker died

#58

Post by Frondo »

RHSeeger wrote: post #51
frgtpsswrdlame wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ending right to work laws and bringing back unions.

Of course, that too comes with it's negatives. Unions have both positives and negatives. It's not a simple discussion.

What is an alternative to unions that gives workers some power in the relationship between worker and employer?

Re: Undercover in a Toronto factory where a temp worker died

#59

Post by randomdata »

wiz21c wrote: post #4
grecy wrote: post #2

Many companies in countries like Canada and Australia are now trying harder than ever to emulate the United States with it's extremely low wages, health, benefits, etc. for temp or casual workers. Unfortunately, it's a race to the bottom, as tens of millions of Americas will attest to. My simple question is - can we justify treating humans like this in the name of increasing profit?

My second question is : why don't union gets bigger and stronger ? Millions can't be put on the brink on poverty without an answer. Yesterday, on a european TV, I saw a documentary about middle class people who became half-homeless (their words). They were just unlucky to loose their jobs. Now I understand they may have had too much credits or debts here and there but, these were middle class, that is, they went down…

More importantly, why don't strong unions do something about it? The mid-1980s saw the strongest unionization period for Canada – with nearly a 40% unionization rate – but all the of same declines mentioned by the parent were quite visible then. Wages, for instance, have been stagnant since the late 1960s. There was plenty of opportunity to fix the problems during those best union years.

Unionization has declined somewhat since that time, but is still fairly strong in Canada today, with about 30% unionization. The six strongest unionized country in the world. That matches the peak unionization rate for the USA (down to about 10% today), which is heralded for bringing great working improvements for the American worker. There really should be no reason why the current unions in Canada cannot improve on these things. History has shown that 30% unionization is enough to change the world.

I expect that unionization is declining, rather than strengthening, because the potential members are feeling like the unions have become self-serving or are resting on their laurels.

Re: Undercover in a Toronto factory where a temp worker died

#60

Post by err4nt »

FLGMwt wrote: post #49
asdfasdfasd333 wrote: post #48

In August, charges were laid against Fiera Foods under the Occupational Health and Safety Act for the 2016 death of a temp agency worker named Amina Diaby. Her hijab was caught in a machine, strangling her. /thread.

Not sure what you're trying to convey?

Every single woodworking shop, electric shop, factory, etc I've been in they always make a big deal about _never_ wearing loose-fitting clothing, long hair or necklaces or bracelets - anything you wouldn't want torn off you at a fast rate of speed with force you remove or restrain. This is common sense and common instruction - I'm not sure what employment safety laws say about this.

If the cause of her death was loose-fitting clothing that's normally prohibited from those environments because it's a serious danger and workers have been getting caught in machinery as long as we've had machinery to get caught in - and the only reason she was able to wear the clothing in that environment was because of her religious rights guaranteed under the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms (which states that her religious rights supersede any written legal code) then this mortal risk might be something she fought to take on, even if the company recommended against it.

Imagine for a second that you're a motorcycle police officer, where it's customary (even law) to wear a helmet, but you (for religious reasons) wanted to wear your religious headwear in lieu of a helmet. Then imagine you were killed on the job in a motorcycle crash due to a blow to the skull. Would there be a need for a month-long undercover investigation to uncover the reason you died?

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