The problem is largely the UK's lack of a constitution. There are no checks or balances in the UK. Parliament can literally do anything they want. The courts can't block Parliament. Parliament can just abolish the courts. The house of lords can't stop the house of commons, the commons can just override the lords. The queen won't veto the commons because she fears parliament will just abolish the monarchy.
Right, because constitutions don't generally have a mechanism to be amended? And the judiciary in countries with constitutions don't tend to apply constitution to areas that they were clearly never intended e.g. encryption. The idea that the UK parliament would abolish courts doesn't really need addressing, it's so absurd. I take it you're also aware that we regularly (some would say too regularly) democratically ele…
Real people don't need end-to-end encryption says UK Home Secretary
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Re: Real people don't need end-to-end encryption says UK Home Secretary
#52Basically she's saying chat apps in the UK shouldn't be allowed end-to-end encryption. So the terrorists will setup a chat system that look like payments. In the mean-time, the UK government will use our chat to identify harmless political dissidents, groom them online and then fail to incite them to violence. Given previous performance, they will meet some of their targets, get a few pregnant and then get sued 20 ye…
Re: Real people don't need end-to-end encryption says UK Home Secretary
#53Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm really not trying to be pedantic, but that's not true. The UK has no written constitution but it does have a constitution. It's important to make the distinction because it is entirely possible that this proposal is unconstitutional (and I wonder if that's why the Home Secretary is asking for companies to voluntarily adopt it rather than passing legislation). It smells unconstitutional to me because it is an atta…
There's no entrenched right to privacy in the domestic constitution. The Human Rights Act has, though, brought Article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights into UK law: > 1. Everyone has the right to respect for his private and family life, his home and his correspondence. > 2. There shall be no interference by a public authority with the exercise of this right except such as is in accordance with the law and…
Re: Real people don't need end-to-end encryption says UK Home Secretary
#54Re: Real people don't need end-to-end encryption says UK Home Secretary
#55It'll be interesting in 10-15 years when the US is one of the few countries left that allow unfettered access to encryption, VPNs, secure messaging, etc. How does the saying go? "The dark night of fascism is always descending in the United States and yet lands only in Europe"
Re: Real people don't need end-to-end encryption says UK Home Secretary
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
Say a smartphone app ran both an https client and server. For users to send each other messages, they connect to each others servers. That's end to end encryption, right? And looks identical to the type of encryption they'd still allow right? What have I missed?
I guess once it gets popular, they just force Apple and Google to remove it from the apps store. So it has to be a web site with all the http server running in javascript/web assembly. I guess you still need a central server to let clients find each other in the first place. They could block that at the DNS level.
Obviously you can't intercept signals from someone using outlawed encryption, a one time pad or no direct messages. I'm not sure the stated goal (stop evil terrorists) is the real goal though - reading almost all communications and selective leaks is just such a useful tool for things like subverting democracy, throwing elections and controlling politicians.
Re: Real people don't need end-to-end encryption says UK Home Secretary
#57Earlier quoted context omitted.
There's no entrenched right to privacy in the domestic constitution. The Human Rights Act has, though, brought Article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights into UK law: > 1. Everyone has the right to respect for his private and family life, his home and his correspondence. > 2. There shall be no interference by a public authority with the exercise of this right except such as is in accordance with the law and…
The commons can withdraw from the ECHR. I am not saying that Parliament is not a check on ministers. I am saying that there is no check on Parliament. A simple majority of parliament can pass anything and there is no entity that can stop it from becoming law.
A withholding of assent could bring a constitutional crisis, but it's possible [1].
Re: Real people don't need end-to-end encryption says UK Home Secretary
#58Earlier quoted context omitted.
Say a smartphone app ran both an https client and server. For users to send each other messages, they connect to each others servers. That's end to end encryption, right? And looks identical to the type of encryption they'd still allow right? What have I missed?
I guess once it gets popular, they just force Apple and Google to remove it from the apps store. So it has to be a web site with all the http server running in javascript/web assembly. I guess you still need a central server to let clients find each other in the first place. They could block that at the DNS level.
Would you? Couldn't you have a list of servers stored in localstorage, and bake the initial list in a bunch of seed copies?
Alternatively, use pastebin or imgur or something like that for your "central store" to pull from initially, then store everything in localstorage after.
Re: Real people don't need end-to-end encryption says UK Home Secretary
#59Earlier quoted context omitted.
I guess once it gets popular, they just force Apple and Google to remove it from the apps store. So it has to be a web site with all the http server running in javascript/web assembly. I guess you still need a central server to let clients find each other in the first place. They could block that at the DNS level.
I'd use bank accounts, PayPal or money transfer with small transactions and a one time pad to signal. They'll never ban bank accounts and it'd be hard to find signals amongst the noise. Or you could just use pgp and paste it into whatever app you want. Pandora's box has been opened, its remarkably naive to try to ban secrets at the same time as hoarding an unprecedented number of signals. Obviously you can't intercep…
Maybe someone out there needs to air her dirty laundry secrets that she's projecting on the rest of the population?
Re: Real people don't need end-to-end encryption says UK Home Secretary
#60It'll be interesting in 10-15 years when the US is one of the few countries left that allow unfettered access to encryption, VPNs, secure messaging, etc. How does the saying go? "The dark night of fascism is always descending in the United States and yet lands only in Europe"
its only a matter of time before the USA outlaws these also. I know the agencies are itching for it. Even though it would be unworkable.
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2015/04/remembering-case-estab...