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Trump announces plans to privatize US air traffic control system

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Re: Trump announces plans to privatize US air traffic control system

#51

Post by linkregister »

kevinburke wrote: post #34
kem wrote: post #25

A monolithic private institution doesn't inspire confidence in me any more than a monolithic public one. I don't see the purpose in switching one for the other, and would probably rather see it run by the government. If it was replacing the current system with one where you had 12 different companies competing with one another, maybe so but I don't really see the benefit in what I'm reading. But I don't feel strongly…

"The New York metropolitan area is the single largest aviation market in the United States. Last year, there were nearly 33 million domestic origin and destination passengers that came to and from the three major New York airports (LaGuardia, Kennedy and Newark). Nearly 60% of the total delays endured by these passengers are a result of today’s inefficient air traffic control, among the highest in the nation." http:/…

I recommend you explain what benefit a transfer to private administration would offer, because the article doesn't actually make any statement about what would improve.

According to the article, which does not cite any study or even interview a single official or anyone from the airlines, there are two obstacles posed by the current "inefficient" system:

1) Antiquated technology, and 2) insufficient staffing levels.

To remedy these issues, we would need to look at solutions for the existing system and compare them with the new one.

I actually don't disagree that a private organization might be better; if the limits on staffing and equipment procurement are imposed by Congress, then it might be better for a private organization to simply raise rates on airlines to account for the increased costs.

Re: Trump announces plans to privatize US air traffic control system

#52

Post by mmirate »

d0lph wrote: post #15
mmanfrin wrote: post #8

Why . I don't get this at all. Why privatize? What is the benefit? All I see this doing is decreasing safety.

Private organizations are more efficient than governmental ones. Ideally the way they are managed/regulated will remain the same. It would be really neat to see some innovation here as well, with governmental agencies there really isn't an incentive to break the status quo. edit: If you're downvoting at least comment with why you think this isn't the case

Without having multiple competing private orgs, what incentive do they have to be more efficient instead of sitting on their butts as usual?

(I'm not saying that privatization alone has no potential or that it is not necessary; I merely question whether it is sufficient.)

Re: Trump announces plans to privatize US air traffic control system

#53

Post by linkregister »

kevinburke wrote: post #21
mmanfrin wrote: post #8

Why . I don't get this at all. Why privatize? What is the benefit? All I see this doing is decreasing safety.

Here's a helpful article: http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/air-traffic-control-tech-...

The article's argument is that the current U.S. ATC system is understaffed and has antiquated equipment. It doesn't actually help explain what privatization would accomplish.

Re: Trump announces plans to privatize US air traffic control system

#54

Post by rtx »

icebraining wrote: post #36
rtx wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These people are not being fired, just being transferred to a new company. I believe they will continue to perform at the same level. And with a non-gov entity we also get the benefit of optimal resource allocation. A win-win for everyone. Only reason of opposing this would be personal vendetta against Trump.

with a non-gov entity we also get the benefit of optimal resource allocation How do you figure?

Not referencing a whole field dedicated to this. Just sharing an anecdote. My father works for a government mining company. His job is that of a translator. Now no one use the language he was supposed to translate from. So he goes to office does some stuff and come backs home. We get govt housing and energy, medical (children till 25 and employees parent till death, two paid yearly holidays for the whole family.

Re: Trump announces plans to privatize US air traffic control system

#55

Post by Florin_Andrei »

rtx wrote: post #31
mullen wrote: post #14

> Donald Trump on Monday unveiled his proposal to hand over control of the U.S. air-traffic control system to a non-profit corporation, calling the current system an antiquated mess that doesn’t work and wastes money. Did someone point out to this idiot that we are having a string of years where there are no deaths in domestic commercial travel. Whatever is happening in the US Traffic System appears to be working rea…

These people are not being fired, just being transferred to a new company. I believe they will continue to perform at the same level. And with a non-gov entity we also get the benefit of optimal resource allocation. A win-win for everyone. Only reason of opposing this would be personal vendetta against Trump.

> with a non-gov entity we also get the benefit of optimal resource allocation

Yes, we know this must be the ultimate truth, always, everywhere, because Ayn Rand says so.

/s

Re: Trump announces plans to privatize US air traffic control system

#56

Post by Florin_Andrei »

goodcanadian wrote: post #49

While I would have liked to find a source other than the Cato institute for it ( https://www.cato.org/blog/trump-pursues-air-traffic-control-... ): The airlines are for it, the key labor union is for it, aviation experts are for it, and the second-largest nation on earth did it. Canada privatized its system in 1996, and today the nonprofit Nav Canada is on the leading edge of ATC efficiency and innovation.

Ah, yes, Cato Institute, that paragon of unbiased, reality-based thought.

/s

Re: Trump announces plans to privatize US air traffic control system

#57

Post by Florin_Andrei »

thevtm wrote: post #46
twinkletwinkle wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, but why. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Is there any evidence that our current system doesn't work?

$

That is usually pretty powerful "evidence".

Re: Trump announces plans to privatize US air traffic control system

#59

Post by oh_sigh »

mullen wrote: post #14

> Donald Trump on Monday unveiled his proposal to hand over control of the U.S. air-traffic control system to a non-profit corporation, calling the current system an antiquated mess that doesn’t work and wastes money. Did someone point out to this idiot that we are having a string of years where there are no deaths in domestic commercial travel. Whatever is happening in the US Traffic System appears to be working rea…

Maybe you're the idiot, if you think that passenger fatalities is the only metric that matters(note: it matters a lot!)

How can you know how well the US ATC is operating if you don't know how much money they spend? If they spent 10x what they currently do(but still had no passenger fatalities), would you say everything is great?

Re: Trump announces plans to privatize US air traffic control system

#60

Post by treebeard901 »

ericfrederich wrote: post #3

My guess is that he has some personal vendetta against them for something that happened causing him to be delayed 5 minutes on his private jet.

The personal vendetta, while probably true on some level, seems too easy of an answer. This is one of many privatization initiatives this administration is going to take.

The focus initially will be to find government run agencies that can be profitable in the private sector. Think in terms of toll roads/bridges for infrastructure, air traffic control and student loans to name a few. Whether or not if privatization is the right answer is debateable but it is probably going to happen in one form or another.

The question is: Who will benefit by owning these companies? Look to the privatization of the USSR as a worst possible outcome. Large former government run industries given to private ownership that instantly created a strong oligarchy class.

How well has democracy worked in Russia since that happened?

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