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Some Reflections on Being Turned Down for a Lot of Data Science Jobs

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Re: Some Reflections on Being Turned Down for a Lot of Data Science Jobs

#51

Post by jedberg »

CSDude wrote: post #29

At least you have been told the reasons, even if they are true or not. I recently had many tech/behavioral interview with team and passed, but after a review with VP of X, saying we decided not to move forward is way worse than this. I still keeep wondering 'What is wrong with me?' even after years of interviews. I have some suspicions, but never a promising answer. If I oneday found a company, first company policy w…

> first company policy would be to tell the candidates to tell why they were not hired in a polite way.

And your lawyers would strongly advocate against that.

In most cases they can't/won't tell you because it could open up legal liability. If they say a reason for you, but then hire someone else to whom that reason also applies and you find out, you could sue them. Or you could find a way to twist it into something against a protected class. Too many ways for the company to get screwed.

That's why they all say "we've decided to go another way" or something equally generic.

Re: Some Reflections on Being Turned Down for a Lot of Data Science Jobs

#52

Post by jknoepfler »

Bootvis wrote: post #34
halflings wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ignoring what a p-value is does not mean that you don't know statistics. p-tests are not some inherent statistical property, they're just a useful model for significance. People coming from a CS background most likely didn't have to deal with p-values, but they can still be good at linear algebra or bayesian statistics. (not sure I can defend somebody that does not know what precision/recall are)

Regarding precision/recall, I've a background in financial econometrics and this is the first time I encounter the terms.

It's literally the first thing you learn in data science / machine learning coursework about evaluating model performance. It would probably be better to ask the candidate to whiteboard a set of metrics for evaluating model performance rather than ask for the definition of a pair of words, but the concept is practically the for-loop of data science.

Edit: note that I'm not saying you need this to add roi as an analyst for a business!

Re: Some Reflections on Being Turned Down for a Lot of Data Science Jobs

#53

Post by FeatureRush »

kafkaesq wrote: post #47

So you're at least occasionally getting actual feedback from some of these discussions. That's quite something, actually. BTW, as to some of that "feedback": Honestly, I think the way you communicated your thought process and results was confusing for some people in the room. "Okay, pal - let's put your people up in a room full of strangers (some of whom show through their body language and/or constant phone-checking…

Without context the second quote sounded to me not like an accusation of slacking but like a warning that the company is bad place to work at (poor life-work balance)...

Re: Some Reflections on Being Turned Down for a Lot of Data Science Jobs

#54

Post by santaclaus »

yttrium wrote: post #49
tom_b wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if you are less impacted by the lack of CS degree than by your "Software QA Engineer" label. My own experience was that my initial position as a software performance engineer resulted in a perception that I was a "tester" without technical skills despite having multiple CS credentials and published code in practitioner-oriented sources. Overcoming recruiter biases was such a struggle that I now routinely cou…

I had a similar experience. My first job out of college was for a Developer Role (building testing frameworks, maintaining and building browser extensions) but the job was titled 'QA Developer' so I had a hell of a time the first time I tried to find a new job. Never mind that I wrote thousands and thousands of lines of application code, lots of recruiters would deny me on the basis that my background didn't fit.

Did you try dropping the exact title from your resume for a more general description of the role?

Re: Some Reflections on Being Turned Down for a Lot of Data Science Jobs

#55

Post by bsg75 »

> Quite honestly given your questions [about vacation policy] and the fact that you are considering other options, [we] may not be the best choice for you.

Dodged a bullet on that one:

- PTO is a touchy subject?

- They are looking at more than one candidate, why would any candidate limit themselves to one potential employer?

Re: Some Reflections on Being Turned Down for a Lot of Data Science Jobs

#57

Post by Bootvis »

jknoepfler wrote: post #52
Bootvis wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regarding precision/recall, I've a background in financial econometrics and this is the first time I encounter the terms.

It's literally the first thing you learn in data science / machine learning coursework about evaluating model performance. It would probably be better to ask the candidate to whiteboard a set of metrics for evaluating model performance rather than ask for the definition of a pair of words, but the concept is practically the for-loop of data science. Edit: note that I'm not saying you need this to add roi as an analys…

I haven't taken a lot of data science classes but I'm not sure that's true. If you start with linear regression the mean squared error would make more sense. I actually searched through "The Elements of Statistical Learning" and the word 'recall' is not used in this sense at all.

Re: Some Reflections on Being Turned Down for a Lot of Data Science Jobs

#58

Post by emplynx »

mindcrime wrote: post #30
wgyn wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that just "networking" would be the wrong takeaway, though. The author[0] is pretty active on Twitter / the blogosphere and, even though I don't follow him personally, his writing has popped up on my feed a number of times. He's likely meeting people and having interesting conversations ("networking") because he has interesting things to say. [0] https://twitter.com/tdhopper

Not just blogging, but Tim is also active in terms of attending / speaking at various industry conferences and what-not. Whether he is doing it simply to "build his brand" or because he genuinely enjoys it, or both, is something I can't speak to. But I think he's definitely "meeting people and having interesting conversations".

Hi Phil!

Re: Some Reflections on Being Turned Down for a Lot of Data Science Jobs

#59

Post by emplynx »

CSDude wrote: post #29

At least you have been told the reasons, even if they are true or not. I recently had many tech/behavioral interview with team and passed, but after a review with VP of X, saying we decided not to move forward is way worse than this. I still keeep wondering 'What is wrong with me?' even after years of interviews. I have some suspicions, but never a promising answer. If I oneday found a company, first company policy w…

The reasons are rarely shared unsolicited. It's usually because I asked (no harm in that) or knew someone on the inside.
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