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Who Needs GPS? The Story of Etak's 1985 Car Navigation System

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Re: Who Needs GPS? The Story of Etak's 1985 Car Navigation System

#51

Post by [deleted] »

nradov wrote: post #8
teddyh wrote: post #2

Interesting to read about alternative, non-centralized, forms of navigation. I wish modern cars which already have all the necessary sensors would use this method as a fallback, since GPS reception is not always available.

Vehicle speed and steering position are available through OBDII. And inexpensive Bluetooth OBDII interfaces are available. But I don't think that navigation app developers have done anything to take advantage of that data for dead reckoning input. http://www.plxdevices.com/category-s/195.htm

[deleted]

Re: Who Needs GPS? The Story of Etak's 1985 Car Navigation System

#52

Post by DonHopkins »

teddyh wrote: post #2

Interesting to read about alternative, non-centralized, forms of navigation. I wish modern cars which already have all the necessary sensors would use this method as a fallback, since GPS reception is not always available.

Some of TomTom's high-end devices like the TomTom GO 920 have built-in accelerometers and gyros, and use "Enhanced Positioning Technology" to perform augmented dead reckoning when GPS signals are not available, like in tunnels and highly built-up areas.

http://corporate.tomtom.com/releasedetail.cfm?releaseid=3185...

Best navigation with Enhanced Positioning Technology

TomTom’s new Enhanced Positioning Technology uses movement and gravity sensors to calculate drivers’ positions when GPS signals are unavailable.

TomTom GO 920 T users will have a much more continuous navigation experience as the Enhanced Positioning Technology ensures the device continues to navigate to its destination, even in circumstances where there may not be a direct line-of-sight connection to a satellite. For example, when driving in a city with tall buildings, underpasses or bridges.

http://www.pocketgpsworld.com/tomtom-go-930-review-a1042.php

As you drive along you will often encounter places where the Satellite signal is blocked such as tunnels and underground parking lots. TomTom has introduced a system called EPT (Enhanced Position Technology) to keep track of your position using accelerometers. This is not as accurate as GPS but will help guide you in places like Boston where the Big Dig has created a network of underground roads.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TomTom#Enhanced_Positioning

2008: Enhanced Positioning

TomTom released the GO x30 range in April 2008 based on NavCore 8. New features included IQ Routes, which estimated journey times based on average recorded speeds, rather than speed limits, and Advanced Lane Guidance, an on-screen representation of the correct lane to take. The 930, like the x20, had Enhanced Positioning Technology. GSM HD Traffic receivers, plugging into the car's cigarette lighter, added HD Traffic to the GO range.

Refreshed ONE and XL models were released in May 2008, still based on NavCore 7, with an improved speaker.

NavCore 8 updates for NavCore 7 devices, including the ONE v3 and v4, were released in June 2008, giving x20 users (only) IQ Routes and Advanced Lane Guidance, with the purchase of new maps.

Re: Who Needs GPS? The Story of Etak's 1985 Car Navigation System

#53

Post by wolfgang42 »

Lx1oG-AWb6h_ZG0 wrote: post #24
teddyh wrote: post #2

Interesting to read about alternative, non-centralized, forms of navigation. I wish modern cars which already have all the necessary sensors would use this method as a fallback, since GPS reception is not always available.

Every single mapping app has to implement some kind of mapmatching, since you can't rely on the GPS sensors to always be accurate: the GPS position is frequently wrong when you're moving between cell towers , and can be lost for several seconds in cities. Nokia/HERE's implementation (which I was told was very similar to tomtom/garmin's implementation) was written more than a decade ago, and IIRC, every time it encoun…

> the GPS position is frequently wrong when you're moving between cell towers , and can be lost for several seconds in cities.

You seem to be thinking of cell tower triangulation, not GPS. I do agree that GPS also does not do particularly well in areas with large buildings: it needs a clear view of the sky which can be hard to come by when there's skyscrapers everywhere.

Re: Who Needs GPS? The Story of Etak's 1985 Car Navigation System

#54

Post by jansenv »

avar wrote: post #21
mmastrac wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> about 20% of the population could not cope with a map that wasn't aligned with the direction they were going That's me. I have a tough time orienting maps in my head. I still use a mnemonic for compass directions and (occasionally) use my left hand as an L to make sure I'm not screwing it up. I don't know if there is any research into what the structural differences of brains that suffer from this might be, let alo…

> I don't know if there is any research into [needing to > reorient maps when driving]. There is! One thing it's highly correlated with is whether you're either a heterosexual woman, or a homosexual man. There's a really good description of this and other brain attributes correlated with gender or male homosexuality in the BBC show "The Making of Me - John Barrowman". This specific part starts around 6m30s in: http:/…

This is extremely fascinating! It seems like an almost un-pc fact.

Re: Who Needs GPS? The Story of Etak's 1985 Car Navigation System

#55

Post by civilian »

Arizhel wrote: post #42
learn_more wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you train yourself to use a static orientation however, you develop a much better "big picture" awareness of the city you drive in, eventually freeing yourself from requiring navigational assistance. The additional cognitive load is worth it for me.

I can't imagine why you wouldn't want navigational assistance. The only time I drive without my GPS is if I'm going somewhere I go frequently, along a route I normally travel, and it's a short distance. Any place new, and I'm using GPS, and even if I'm going someplace familiar, and I'm familiar with the route, if it's a good distance away I use the GPS anyway to make sure I don't miss a turn and also, very importantl…

So here's the thing: If you use GPS, you aren't going to build up your mental map of your city. But if you go without GPS, then you will work towards building up your mental map, and it kind of snowballs.

I really like to: Look up directions on Gmaps, and then jot down the relevant turns I need to know onto a piece of paper. The idea is that Gmaps tells me 20 or so turns, but I really need to only know a highway exit # and a few turns.

The awesome thing is that I've often _forgotten that piece of paper_! But because I went through the act of writing it down, it's stuck in my memory, and I'm usually able to figure it out without checking my phone.

I have a friend who's a great software engineer, and he has great visual/spatial awareness, but he always drives by GPS, and it's kind of embarrassing to sit in the car for two minutes while he gets directions ready to go. -_-

Re: Who Needs GPS? The Story of Etak's 1985 Car Navigation System

#56

Post by douche »

sedachv wrote: post #45
Arizhel wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't imagine why you wouldn't want navigational assistance. The only time I drive without my GPS is if I'm going somewhere I go frequently, along a route I normally travel, and it's a short distance. Any place new, and I'm using GPS, and even if I'm going someplace familiar, and I'm familiar with the route, if it's a good distance away I use the GPS anyway to make sure I don't miss a turn and also, very importantl…

> I can't imagine why you wouldn't want navigational assistance. Here is why I look up directions in advance in almost all situations: * GPS is a distraction to maintaining awareness while driving, motorcycling, and bicycling. * Navigational assistance does not help you when walking, taking public transit or taxis. Using GPS while driving prevents you from learning the layout of the place you are in which transfers t…

GPS also does not work underground. Anyone who has driven through Boston's Big Dig and tried to rely on turn-by-turn directions quickly learns this, accompanied by much cursing.

Re: Who Needs GPS? The Story of Etak's 1985 Car Navigation System

#57

Post by strawberrycough »

jansenv wrote: post #54
avar wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't know if there is any research into [needing to > reorient maps when driving]. There is! One thing it's highly correlated with is whether you're either a heterosexual woman, or a homosexual man. There's a really good description of this and other brain attributes correlated with gender or male homosexuality in the BBC show "The Making of Me - John Barrowman". This specific part starts around 6m30s in: http:/…

This is extremely fascinating! It seems like an almost un-pc fact.

Imagine that. Facts and political correctness in diametric opposition.

Re: Who Needs GPS? The Story of Etak's 1985 Car Navigation System

#59

Post by RJIb8RBYxzAMX9u »

civilian wrote: post #55
Arizhel wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't imagine why you wouldn't want navigational assistance. The only time I drive without my GPS is if I'm going somewhere I go frequently, along a route I normally travel, and it's a short distance. Any place new, and I'm using GPS, and even if I'm going someplace familiar, and I'm familiar with the route, if it's a good distance away I use the GPS anyway to make sure I don't miss a turn and also, very importantl…

So here's the thing: If you use GPS, you aren't going to build up your mental map of your city. But if you go without GPS, then you will work towards building up your mental map, and it kind of snowballs. I really like to: Look up directions on Gmaps, and then jot down the relevant turns I need to know onto a piece of paper. The idea is that Gmaps tells me 20 or so turns, but I really need to only know a highway exit…

Personally, I don't care that using a map would make me a "better navigator" the same way I don't care that driving stick would make me a "better driver." I don't enjoy driving at all, it's purely a mean to an end, so I'll take any aid that would make the experience more pleasant, and / or reduce my cognitive load.

If I ever start making FU money, and fully self-driving cars are not yet a reality, I would definitely hire chauffeur(s) to drive me around. S/he could use a map, s/he so chooses...

Re: Who Needs GPS? The Story of Etak's 1985 Car Navigation System

#60

Post by Cyph0n »

DonHopkins wrote: post #26

"Etak eventually became a part of TomTom, ensuring that its map data, some of which was first digitized back during the Navigator's development in 1984, would live on to this day." The story of how TomTom and not Garmin ended up owning the data originally digitized at Etak is interesting. At the time, there were only two digital map companies: Tele Atlas (from which TomTom got their map data) and Navteq (from which G…

That sounds like it would be an amazing plot point for a show like Billions. Garmin basically did the impossible: force a supplier of a scarce product to renegotiate their position. Amazing story, thanks for posting.
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