I wish I knew why the concept of hypocrisy is so difficult to grasp that people are prone to apply it incorrectly. Maybe people just don't understand when someone is making a moral statement, and when someone isn't. The claim here appears to be that since Apple ships Windows apps that don't use that platform to its fullest, Jobs cannot claim that least-common-denominator middleware is unhealthy for a platform. That m…
I strongly disagree with the author, but I grasp his point of view. Let me try to explain it. There exists an ideology of "open is always better than closed": open source is better than closed source, open formats are better than proprietary formats, etc. When Jobs talks about WebKit/SquirrelFish being open source implementations of open standards, he is, intentionally or not, appealing to that audience. But obviousl…
Jobs on Flash: Hypocrisy So Thick You Could Cut it with a Knife
51–60 of 119 posts
Re: Jobs on Flash: Hypocrisy So Thick You Could Cut it with a Knife
#52Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think he mostly argues about the fact that Jobs stated Flash not being and open standard as a reason not to support it. I hope we can all agree that Apple has never really been an open standards company and as the author points out, they've mostly stated this for marketing purposes while not fully embracing the idea.
I hope we can all agree that Apple has never really been an open standards company We cannot. I strongly disagree. At least in the web space there is a lot of innovation comming from or strongly supported by Apple.
Re: Jobs on Flash: Hypocrisy So Thick You Could Cut it with a Knife
#53Earlier quoted context omitted.
Is it not hypocritical to hold others to higher standards than one demonstrates? I see a normative claim: Software systems should do X, Y, and Z Software systems that do not meet the norm are penalized or disallowed by Apple's platform(s). However, Apple's own software does not meet this norm either, even on Apple's own platform. It sure seems like hypocrisy to me, even if it is defensible.
Why bother inventing an abstract normative claim when you can quote the actual (and only) one that appears in the document: "...we strongly believe that all standards pertaining to the web should be open." Now, proceed from there.
> Adobe has been painfully slow to adopt enhancements to Apple’s platforms. For example, although Mac OS X has been shipping for almost 10 years now, Adobe just adopted it fully (Cocoa) two weeks ago
I was thinking specifically of the Cocoa norm -- which iTunes apparently does not meet -- I should have made that more clear.
How much more open is H.264 than SWF and FLV, anyway?
> Adobe’s Flash products are 100% proprietary. They are only available from Adobe
Assuming Jobs is not declaring an obvious tautology, he is omitting FOSS efforts such as Gnash and Swfdec.
Re: Jobs on Flash: Hypocrisy So Thick You Could Cut it with a Knife
#54I don't understand the big deal. Do people really love developing in flash that much? Is the flash development community really this big? I have a feeling that a lot of people are jumping on the bandwagon because it gets attention. It is really weird, before this everyone hated flash. It was pretty well accepted as a necessary evil that we all wished we could do without (at least that is the vibe I got). We are now a…
Windows users don't hate Flash nearly as much as OSX users. Performance plays a role, no doubt.
Re: Jobs on Flash: Hypocrisy So Thick You Could Cut it with a Knife
#55iTunes sucking on Windows doesn't make them hypocrites, it helps prove their point. I'm sure Apple would rather not have to release a Windows version of iTunes, but it's necessary to sell more iPods.
iTunes sucks on windows because it does not take advantage of windows. If windows was the iPhone and iTunes was an app it would have been banned a long time ago.
Not that I agree with their policies, but this article's arguments aren't very good.
Re: Jobs on Flash: Hypocrisy So Thick You Could Cut it with a Knife
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think he mostly argues about the fact that Jobs stated Flash not being and open standard as a reason not to support it. I hope we can all agree that Apple has never really been an open standards company and as the author points out, they've mostly stated this for marketing purposes while not fully embracing the idea.
> I hope we can all agree that Apple has never really been an open standards company Show me this for Flash: http://trac.webkit.org/ Or this: http://www.opensource.apple.com/release/mac-os-x-1063/ And check out paragraph 2: http://webkit.org/projects/goals.html Fire up Chrome to check out how many re-implementations of WebKit are out there based on this open source and open standards base.
http://www.adobe.com/devnet/swf/
> Or this:
http://opensource.adobe.com/wiki/display/site/Home
> And check out paragraph 2:
http://www.openscreenproject.org/partners/current_partners.h...
Re: Jobs on Flash: Hypocrisy So Thick You Could Cut it with a Knife
#57Re: Jobs on Flash: Hypocrisy So Thick You Could Cut it with a Knife
#58Re: Jobs on Flash: Hypocrisy So Thick You Could Cut it with a Knife
#59I wish I knew why the concept of hypocrisy is so difficult to grasp that people are prone to apply it incorrectly. Maybe people just don't understand when someone is making a moral statement, and when someone isn't. The claim here appears to be that since Apple ships Windows apps that don't use that platform to its fullest, Jobs cannot claim that least-common-denominator middleware is unhealthy for a platform. That m…
"You know, when I was a young man, hypocrisy was deemed the worst of vices," Finkle-McGraw said. "It was all because of moral relativism. You see, in that sort of a climate, you are not allowed to criticise others--after all, if there is no absolute right and wrong, then what grounds is there for criticism?"
...
"Now, this led to a good deal of general frustration, for people are naturally censorious and love nothing better than to criticise others' shortcomings. And so it was that they seized on hypocrisy and elevated it from a ubiquitous peccadillo into the monarch of all vices. For, you see, even if there is no right and wrong, you can find grounds to criticise another person by contrasting what he has espoused with what he has actually done. In this case, you are not making any judgment whatsoever as to the correctness of his views or the morality of his behaviour--you are merely pointing out that he has said one thing and done another. Virtually all political discourse in the days of my youth was devoted to the ferreting out of hypocrisy.
...
"We take a somewhat different view of hypocrisy," Finkle-McGraw continued. "In the late-twentieth-century Weltanschauung, a hypocrite was someone who espoused high moral views as part of a planned campaign of deception--he never held these beliefs sincerely and routinely violated them in privacy. Of course, most hypocrites are not like that. Most of the time it's a spirit-is-willing, flesh-is-weak sort of thing."
"That we occasionally violate our own stated moral code," Major Napier said, working it through, "does not imply that we are insincere in espousing that code." "Of course not," Finkle-McGraw said. "It's perfectly obvious, really. No one ever said that it was easy to hew to a strict code of conduct. Really, the difficulties involved--the missteps we make along the way--are what make it interesting. The internal, and eternal, struggle, between our base impulses and the rigorous demands of our own moral system is quintessentially human. It is how we conduct ourselves in that struggle that determines how we may in time be judged by a higher power." All three men were quiet for a few moments, chewing mouthfuls of beer or smoke, pondering the matter.
(http://fishbowl.pastiche.org/2006/03/21/hypocrisy_is_the_gre...)
Re: Jobs on Flash: Hypocrisy So Thick You Could Cut it with a Knife
#60I wish I knew why the concept of hypocrisy is so difficult to grasp that people are prone to apply it incorrectly. Maybe people just don't understand when someone is making a moral statement, and when someone isn't. The claim here appears to be that since Apple ships Windows apps that don't use that platform to its fullest, Jobs cannot claim that least-common-denominator middleware is unhealthy for a platform. That m…