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U.S. Citizens Now Hold About $1.3 Trillion in Student Loan Debt

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Re: U.S. Citizens Now Hold About $1.3 Trillion in Student Loan Debt

#51

Post by School-Cotton »

chime wrote: post #33
krisroadruck wrote: post #13

I'm curious why we treat student loan debt as being special. We don't make a huge deal out of people taking on other debt and then being unable to pay for it. I think probably if anything, what we should have are better controls for what types of degrees you are allowed to take a loan out for. If your degree of choice is unlikely to yield the kind of return that will pay for it, then you should be required to save up…

> I'm curious why we treat student loan debt as being special. Because you can no longer declare bankruptcy to erase student debt. > If your degree of choice is unlikely to yield the kind of return that will pay for it, then you should be required to save up for it, rather than getting a loan, just like there are qualifications for other loans, like auto or mortgages which look at both the value of the asset vs its s…

It's true only the rich could send their kids to art school, but there are lots of things only the rich can do. What makes you define art school in particular as something we should pay for everyone to do, rather than a luxury?

Keep in mind that resources are limited -- for a given level of taxation, everything the State spends money on means either cutting something else or increasing the debt (thereby making debt service less likely to be sustainable long-term)

Re: U.S. Citizens Now Hold About $1.3 Trillion in Student Loan Debt

#52

Post by cconroy »

rayiner wrote: post #25

We don't need student debt reform (and I say that as someone who has a lot of student debt). Student loan debt is a middle/upper middle class problem. 2/3 of millennials don't have a college degree, disproportionately in the lower and lower middle class. The majority have no student debt. Public money spent on college or debt reform would be a regressive benefit to those who are already better off than the median per…

I don't have numbers but people borrow for associate degrees and some college or to go to Trump U. I would guess most millennials have educational debt and don't have >= bachelor degree.

Re: U.S. Citizens Now Hold About $1.3 Trillion in Student Loan Debt

#53

Post by 75j »

Keverw wrote: post #38
youdounderstand wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That just means your parents wealth will dictate your future even more.

What does parent wealth have to do with it? I watched this documentary years ago. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kC_RYgkkmcM I totally agree with this film. Apparently back in the old days you could work a part time job, and pay for college at night debt free. If the gov keeps handing out loans, then what incentive do schools have to keep their prices low and compete with each other? Oh and then the presidents of so…

> Apparently back in the old days you could work a part time job

Even if that was true, it's not the old days anymore. The college I went to is now at 50,000$+ a year with compulsory room and board. Try paying that off with a part-time job and still competing well with your rich peers.

No matter what, it's an enormous advantage to not have to work while in college. I know I wouldn't have done as well if I was working simultaneously, since I was still stressed out as is.

Re: U.S. Citizens Now Hold About $1.3 Trillion in Student Loan Debt

#54

Post by javagram »

wernercd wrote: post #37
krisroadruck wrote: post #13

I'm curious why we treat student loan debt as being special. We don't make a huge deal out of people taking on other debt and then being unable to pay for it. I think probably if anything, what we should have are better controls for what types of degrees you are allowed to take a loan out for. If your degree of choice is unlikely to yield the kind of return that will pay for it, then you should be required to save up…

> Why we treat student loan debt debt as being different Where is the collateral? You buy a house, don't pay... you lose the house. You buy an education, don't pay... you... lose the education? No bank is going to give money for degrees without a realistic change of getting paid back. They have no fear of getting paid back because you CANT remove the debt via bankruptcy. I think there needs to be a different approach…

Give some sort of limit - 10/20/30 years? - and some sort of max% of income - 10%?. If the loan isn't paid off by the end of the limit at a max % of income, then the loan can then be discharged by bankruptcy.

This already exists in the USA. It's called Income Based Repayment and the outstanding balance of loans and interest is forgiven after 30 years of making payments capped to a certain percentage of income. There is a tax penalty that may or may not still exist in 30 years.

Re: U.S. Citizens Now Hold About $1.3 Trillion in Student Loan Debt

#55

Post by bensanders »

Keverw wrote: post #38
youdounderstand wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That just means your parents wealth will dictate your future even more.

What does parent wealth have to do with it? I watched this documentary years ago. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kC_RYgkkmcM I totally agree with this film. Apparently back in the old days you could work a part time job, and pay for college at night debt free. If the gov keeps handing out loans, then what incentive do schools have to keep their prices low and compete with each other? Oh and then the presidents of so…

To add to that I would argue that if we made sports optional that could also make college cheaper. Not everyone wants to go to a school for the sports team they want to get an education and get out in the real world.

Re: U.S. Citizens Now Hold About $1.3 Trillion in Student Loan Debt

#56

Post by School-Cotton »

pirocks wrote: post #41

I wonder how much money could be saved if the US got rid of its general education based system.

General education requirements in American universities serves the purpose of getting people up to the level of academic high school students in Europe or Asia.

We could get rid of it, but we'd have to fix high schools first. This would likely require admitting that a focus on academic subjects isn't appropriate for everyone. In many European countries, a majority of students go to trade-oriented secondary schools and the minority that goes to academic schools leading to university have to study quite rigorous material in secondary school. That's why their university programs can focus specifically on individual specialties.

For example, the French academic high school diploma (called Baccalauréat Général) is normally considered equivalent to at least a year in a US university.

Re: U.S. Citizens Now Hold About $1.3 Trillion in Student Loan Debt

#57

Post by Keverw »

75j wrote: post #53
Keverw wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does parent wealth have to do with it? I watched this documentary years ago. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kC_RYgkkmcM I totally agree with this film. Apparently back in the old days you could work a part time job, and pay for college at night debt free. If the gov keeps handing out loans, then what incentive do schools have to keep their prices low and compete with each other? Oh and then the presidents of so…

> Apparently back in the old days you could work a part time job Even if that was true, it's not the old days anymore. The college I went to is now at 50,000$+ a year with compulsory room and board. Try paying that off with a part-time job and still competing well with your rich peers. No matter what, it's an enormous advantage to not have to work while in college. I know I wouldn't have done as well if I was working…

Wow, that's about $200,000 over 4 years.

Yeah, I agree it's high. I just think if loans aren't easily given out like they are then colleges would be forced to lower their prices.

Yeah, I feel if you really want to master something you need to do it full time. Just seems like the whole system is screwed up as it is right now. Plus if you got a job at McDonalds and went for a PHD in physics they still count you getting a job even if not in their field as part of their success rate. I feel it's totally misleading.

I don't know if these young people even know what they are getting into. My mom says to just file bankruptcy if it doesn't work out, which isn't true. Many people falsely believe that.

Re: U.S. Citizens Now Hold About $1.3 Trillion in Student Loan Debt

#58

Post by School-Cotton »

brobinson wrote: post #32
Retric wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People can often just leave the country. US law makes it hard to discharge, non US law is another story.

>the act of renouncing U.S. citizenship does not allow persons to avoid possible prosecution for crimes which they may have committed in the United States, or escape the repayment of financial obligations, including child support payments, previously incurred in the United States or incurred as United States citizens abroad. https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal-considerati... I guess if you successfully r…

You can't be arrested for not paying debts. You could probably still visit the US as long as you didn't intend to work there.

Re: U.S. Citizens Now Hold About $1.3 Trillion in Student Loan Debt

#59

Post by jessriedel »

toomanybeersies wrote: post #6

Every time I read articles about student loans in the USA, the options are always presented as either the current state, or free tuition. Why are interest free student loans never floated as an option? Here in New Zealand, our student loans are provided by the government and are interest free as long as we reside in New Zealand. It means that people who don't do tertiary education, or who do a trade, don't subsidise…

> It means that people who don't do tertiary education, or who do a trade, don't subsidise those who go to university.

Well, an interest-free loan is certainly a significant subsidy, as is the direct government support of NZ universities. But I agree this is less subsidy than some European countries where higher education is essentially given away for free.

Re: U.S. Citizens Now Hold About $1.3 Trillion in Student Loan Debt

#60

Post by maxerickson »

aikah wrote: post #50
melling wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wasn't most of that money repaid with interest? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troubled_Asset_Relief_Progra...

> Wasn't most of that money repaid with interest? But how much did it cost to borrow the bailout money at first place ? I'm pretty sure the US government didn't have trillions in cash at that time.

The cost was very low, treasury rates dipped below 1%.

https://www.treasury.gov/resource-center/data-chart-center/i...

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