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Are RethinkDB and Horizon abandoned?

discuss.horizon.io

51–60 of 83 posts

Re: Are RethinkDB and Horizon abandoned?

#51
post #40

This thread seems actively being burried by HN. Now it's flagged as dupe and the previous thread from yesterday also quickly disappeared from the front page after gaining traction. Why are threads that get tons of upvotes and have active commenting going on getting kicked off the frontpage? YCombinator invested in RethinkDB and HN is a YCombinator platform so they have an interest in suppressing speculation or bad ne…

The previous discussion was buried too. I'd also like to know why a link with +250 points is modded away. Obviously they are trying to keep it on the dl, but we really need some transparency when HN the news site conflicts with YC the fund.

Edit: Here's a semi-buried sctb response: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12631225

Re: Are RethinkDB and Horizon abandoned?

#52

Don't want to be accused of being a shill (I'm not, I'm just a fan), but if you're looking for potential alternatives to RethinkDB, Couchbase (the company that was formed when the MemcacheD and CouchDB folks joined forces) offer a totally open source realtime-sync API/SDK (cross-platform: mobile, web, you name it). Link: http://www.couchbase.com/nosql-databases/couchbase-mobile

The deal-breaker for me with couchbase is that the community edition lags (in terms of bug fixes, security updates, etc) 8-10 months behind their commercially licensed offering.

Re: Are RethinkDB and Horizon abandoned?

#53
post #33

RethinkDB kicked (at least) 2 people from their Github organization involved in Horizon development. This tells me they plan to continue the organization in some way--probably under another company and not with Horizon at all. Considering who these 2 people were and their contributions, it wouldn't make any sense for them to hurriedly remove them. (One was also a RethinkDB developer). That is, if the "continuity plan…

So what are you saying?

Re: Are RethinkDB and Horizon abandoned?

#54

Don't want to be accused of being a shill (I'm not, I'm just a fan), but if you're looking for potential alternatives to RethinkDB, Couchbase (the company that was formed when the MemcacheD and CouchDB folks joined forces) offer a totally open source realtime-sync API/SDK (cross-platform: mobile, web, you name it). Link: http://www.couchbase.com/nosql-databases/couchbase-mobile

Ehh, on the Memcached side it was a few contributors (including two major ones, iirc). They're great engineers, but I don't think it's accurate to call them "the Memcached folks". As far as I know, Memcached's longtime maintainer / primary contributor (dormando) is not involved with Couchbase, and neither is Memcached's original creator (bradfitz).

It's more like "one of the memcached contributors", rather than "all the memcached folks".

Couchbase was a merger between NorthScale and CouchOne. The CouchOne founding team were all CouchdDB project founders: Damien Katz, J Chris Anderson, and Jan Lehnardt. NorthScale was founded by Steve Yen, who was an Entrepreneur in Residence at Accel, and Dustin Sallings, who was a committer on the Memcached project.

The first product that NorthScale released was called Membase, and the point of it was to help companies run large memcached clusters without having to think very hard. Couchbase later evolved into a hybrid of Membase and CouchDB that can speak the memcached protocol but also has some of the JSON document database properties that CouchDB has.

Re: Are RethinkDB and Horizon abandoned?

#55

Don't want to be accused of being a shill (I'm not, I'm just a fan), but if you're looking for potential alternatives to RethinkDB, Couchbase (the company that was formed when the MemcacheD and CouchDB folks joined forces) offer a totally open source realtime-sync API/SDK (cross-platform: mobile, web, you name it). Link: http://www.couchbase.com/nosql-databases/couchbase-mobile

The deal-breaker for me with couchbase is that the community edition lags (in terms of bug fixes, security updates, etc) 8-10 months behind their commercially licensed offering.

Developers do have early access to the latest Couchbase EE versions for development and testing as long as they are not using it in production.

If they are using Couchbase in production and they do not want to pay for EE, then they do have to live with the CE lags.

This allows us to maintain a sustainable business model.

Re: Are RethinkDB and Horizon abandoned?

#56

Don't want to be accused of being a shill (I'm not, I'm just a fan), but if you're looking for potential alternatives to RethinkDB, Couchbase (the company that was formed when the MemcacheD and CouchDB folks joined forces) offer a totally open source realtime-sync API/SDK (cross-platform: mobile, web, you name it). Link: http://www.couchbase.com/nosql-databases/couchbase-mobile

The deal-breaker for me with couchbase is that the community edition lags (in terms of bug fixes, security updates, etc) 8-10 months behind their commercially licensed offering.

Some more points ...

1 - Unabashedly, our #1 commitment is to our customers who are relying on Couchbase for their mission critical applications. That's why the Couchbase Enterprise Edition gets the bulk of our attention and testing.

2 - History can show that's it's actually more like 3-6 months of delay rather that 8-10 and corresponds more to our release cycles than to an artificially imposed delay.

3 - Couchbase CE is provided as a service to the community. Users who want to rely upon their own expertise to run a database in production have a responsibility to themselves and their organization to have the appropriate level of skills to do so. That should mean being able to debug and fix bugs themselves. In fact, our open source code base does not lag AT ALL and anyone is welcome to build off of that themselves and get all of the latest and greatest features (and bugs of course). If they're not willing to do this, they should be paying us to.

Re: Are RethinkDB and Horizon abandoned?

#57

Don't want to be accused of being a shill (I'm not, I'm just a fan), but if you're looking for potential alternatives to RethinkDB, Couchbase (the company that was formed when the MemcacheD and CouchDB folks joined forces) offer a totally open source realtime-sync API/SDK (cross-platform: mobile, web, you name it). Link: http://www.couchbase.com/nosql-databases/couchbase-mobile

Couchbase is a very very different product under the hood. Be aware you have to run Couchbase with their minimum spec cluster requirements ( 3 nodes, tons of CPU and RAM ) just to ensure you don't lose data because it syncs from ram to disk at best every 100ms

Hod @ Couchbase here. This is inaccurate. Couchbase does not delay in writing to disk (some other dbs do). You typically want 3 nodes for high availability and failover, but it isn't required. Auto replication can also help avoid loss in many failure scenarios.

Re: Are RethinkDB and Horizon abandoned?

#58
It looks like RethinkDB is relying solely on revenue from training and support. Is that even feasible for a product like theirs?

I've never used their product, I've only looked at their website and was extremely impressed. I remember their bullet points were around clean architecture, testing, performance, etc, all the stuff that engineers/devops folks care the most about, so they can avoid getting paged in the middle of the night to rolling reboot every node in their ${name-of-distributed-database with-scaling-issues} cluster.

But, unfortunately, it seems like if you depend on revenue that derives solely from training and support, you're best bet is to make a product that has:

* Awful documentation (hence the need for people to pay for training)

* Full of bugs and performance issues (hence the need for people to pay for support)

Since from the looks of it, RethinkDB was pretty much the polar opposite of this, it seems like they were essentially a victim of their own perfection.

I wonder if any RethinkDB users out there paid for support just to try to keep RethinkDB alive?

Also, I wonder why RethinkDB doesn't change their revenue model if it's not working for them?

Re: Are RethinkDB and Horizon abandoned?

#60

Slava @ RethinkDB here. I am not able to get into details yet, but the short version is that the commercial entity behind RethinkDB is shutting down. We're working on continuity for the open-source project. Full announcement (and details) coming in a day or two.

Sorry to hear that, but thank you for being forthcoming.
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