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Cyberpower crushes coup

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Re: Cyberpower crushes coup

#51

Post by [deleted] »

j0rd wrote: post #49
T0T0R0 wrote: post #4

Cutting power? Hmmm, not so much. Batteries, generators and wi-fi, coupled with low-power operation modes for modern equipment, are going to be a quick answer to that strategy. Cutting power will buy less than a week of opportunity, and piss off LOTS of other ordinarily unmotivated, apolitical people.

I was in TH for latest coup, took under a couple hours to happen, less than a day to be enforced across country en mass. And I live in the oppositions main stronghold when it happened. Couple hours of lack of information is all you need, and is easiest way to cut all with a single switch. If your power cut out right now, how long till you have net? Your neighbors? Your block? Weeks.

[deleted]

Re: Cyberpower crushes coup

#52

Post by [deleted] »

j0rd wrote: post #49
T0T0R0 wrote: post #4

Cutting power? Hmmm, not so much. Batteries, generators and wi-fi, coupled with low-power operation modes for modern equipment, are going to be a quick answer to that strategy. Cutting power will buy less than a week of opportunity, and piss off LOTS of other ordinarily unmotivated, apolitical people.

I was in TH for latest coup, took under a couple hours to happen, less than a day to be enforced across country en mass. And I live in the oppositions main stronghold when it happened. Couple hours of lack of information is all you need, and is easiest way to cut all with a single switch. If your power cut out right now, how long till you have net? Your neighbors? Your block? Weeks.

[deleted]

Re: Cyberpower crushes coup

#53

Post by HillRat »

walshemj wrote: post #35
iofj wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Staging a false attack on the state is how Hitler suspended civil liberties in Germany, and we all know what happened next.

You mean the Reichstag fire? The consensus is that it was a lone wolf communist - The Nazis where in a panic on the night.

I would read Hett's analysis of the fire and subsequent investigation; there's excellent reason to think that van der Lubbe was not acting alone -- or perhaps not even involved in setting the fires themselves -- and plenty of circumstantial and physical evidence tying the SA and Goebbels to the fire. And, regardless of who set the fire, the Nazis had planned for the institution of emergency rule upon the first pretext; the key elements of what would become the Reichstag Fire Decree were set out weeks before the fire, as Göring would later acknowledge.

Re: Cyberpower crushes coup

#54

Post by safeignorance »

Pica_soO wrote: post #44
ohyes wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Poverty, lack of education, and lack of opportunity would be my trio of undermining traits. It's a lot harder to convince someone with a 9-5 job, a family and a mortgage to overthrow the government. If we think of this as Islamic nationalism , it fits the pattern where things get really bad for common people, and someone rallies them against a perceived other in order to consolidate his own power. Be wary of anyone w…

Other parts of the world had the same loop and broke out of it. Money exists, and even poverty is not universal to the region. Why is there no middle-eastern- tiger state? Lack of Education is unconvincing, the Internet is now available for 20 years. Education is in parts of the region actively rejected as western influence. Late-Medieval Peasants where poor. Yet, in the citys the Renaissance could happen. There is n…

Israel is a relatively rich middle-eastern democracy. Jordan should probably count too (it has its problems, yes, but so do most of the tiger states). Qatar too, to a much lesser extent and esp. if you prioritize wealth/stability over democracy per se. And Saudi Arabia is at least stable and wealthy, if not ticking off the other boxes.

But it's also worth pointing out that outside of the west and regions where the local population was so thoroughly decimated as to make the population effectively European (e.g., US and Canada), free market secular democracies are pretty rare.

Re: Cyberpower crushes coup

#55

Post by T0T0R0 »

goodcanadian wrote: post #9
T0T0R0 wrote: post #4

Cutting power? Hmmm, not so much. Batteries, generators and wi-fi, coupled with low-power operation modes for modern equipment, are going to be a quick answer to that strategy. Cutting power will buy less than a week of opportunity, and piss off LOTS of other ordinarily unmotivated, apolitical people.

Cutting power will buy less than a week of opportunity, and piss off LOTS of other ordinarily unmotivated, apolitical people. You don't need a week; if you don't have any serious opposition under control within a few hours, you've lost.

Right, but cutting power completely might take weeks to reconcile, exposing your faction to painful, expensive, irrecoverable levels of sabotage, even if you do clip a serious opponent's wings doing so.

It might be a move interpreted in ways so politically costly, that you'd only trade a serious opponent in the short term, for an inertia of lasting public resentment that creates larger enemies down the road.

But, break some eggs and make an omelet. What do I know?

Re: Cyberpower crushes coup

#56

Post by Pica_soO »

safeignorance wrote: post #54
Pica_soO wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Other parts of the world had the same loop and broke out of it. Money exists, and even poverty is not universal to the region. Why is there no middle-eastern- tiger state? Lack of Education is unconvincing, the Internet is now available for 20 years. Education is in parts of the region actively rejected as western influence. Late-Medieval Peasants where poor. Yet, in the citys the Renaissance could happen. There is n…

Israel is a relatively rich middle-eastern democracy. Jordan should probably count too (it has its problems, yes, but so do most of the tiger states). Qatar too, to a much lesser extent and esp. if you prioritize wealth/stability over democracy per se. And Saudi Arabia is at least stable and wealthy, if not ticking off the other boxes. But it's also worth pointing out that outside of the west and regions where the lo…

Actually Iran and Turkey would be on my list for close but not yet "Tiger States"- Israel falls under "displaced, but Europe", even in the DVD-Release market.

I know some pretty awesome Pakistani programmers- but they all left there home-country to live somewhere else. They had some "doing well" family background though.

If poverty eats it all, via corruption, would it help to help founders in these states to hide there (relative) "wealth", and the existence of there company/products? Could IP be protected from illegal seezing of governments, by market pressure? Is that even possible - a stealth startup?

Re: Cyberpower crushes coup

#57

Post by walshemj »

HillRat wrote: post #53
walshemj wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean the Reichstag fire? The consensus is that it was a lone wolf communist - The Nazis where in a panic on the night.

I would read Hett's analysis of the fire and subsequent investigation; there's excellent reason to think that van der Lubbe was not acting alone -- or perhaps not even involved in setting the fires themselves -- and plenty of circumstantial and physical evidence tying the SA and Goebbels to the fire. And, regardless of who set the fire, the Nazis had planned for the institution of emergency rule upon the first pretex…

That's not the conclusion that Ian Kershaw came to.
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