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Citigroup fined $7m after legit transactions mistaken for test data for 15 years

theregister.co.uk

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Re: Citigroup fined $7m after legit transactions mistaken for test data for 15 years

#51

Post by arjie »

eru wrote: post #47
jondubois wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was thinking the exact same thing. They should have a really thorough investigation and they need to make sure that NO ONE knew about this bug at any point in the past 15 years. If Citygroup has a habit of hiring and fostering employees who turn a blind eye and keep their mouths shut, then they should be punished severely.

If someone knew and didn't say, they should be punished. If no one knew, the managers who were tasked with setting up procedures and systems for knowing, should be punished.

Dude, they fucked up. You don't have to send Judge Dredd over for this.

Re: Citigroup fined $7m after legit transactions mistaken for test data for 15 years

#52

Post by eru »

trentnelson wrote: post #31
wil421 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd have to disagree on that part. The ATMs that the company I work for run Windows. We are the largest manufacturer, until the other 2 big ones finish merging. Besides, C is 44 years old and used on a ton of stuff.

Interesting. Windows CE? Are there any glaring technical issues you've run into over the years? What processors are the ATMs using?

I guess these machines are not connected to the Internet, and have a very limited user interface surface.

Flaws are less important.

Re: Citigroup fined $7m after legit transactions mistaken for test data for 15 years

#53

Post by HighPlainsDrftr »

eli wrote: post #22
rtpg wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Citigroup failing to send information on 26,810 transactions in over 2,300 such requests. 26810 requests, do you think they made more than $7m on this? It's about proportional fines. Just because they're a giant company doesn't mean we should find then $1b for forgetting to put a handicapped parking space at one of their offices.

There is a school of thought that punitive fines should be a proportion of company value/earnings rather than an absolute dollar figure to exact an equal amount of discomfort. I think Finnish speeding fines are a percent of income.

I've thought long and hard about this for many years. Punitive damages - eg jail time or financial punishment should be removed from our system except in cases where people are unfit to be in society (like murders' etc).

What should happen - all of the management at Citgroup should have to attend a 5 day training provided by the SEC showing how they can fix the reporting problems they have. How it causes problems to society. How it is dishonest - and how it wastes taxpayers dollars.

I'm betting having that happen to Citigroup 2 or 3 times a year would really make them think about following the rules.

Plus - its positive reinforcement instead of negative (punative) damage.

Re: Citigroup fined $7m after legit transactions mistaken for test data for 15 years

#54

Post by cm2187 »

eru wrote: post #50
cm2187 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The other thing is with a company the size of citigroup (250,000 employees), it is statically impossible not to have: - incompetent and/or careless employees and managers - dishonnest employees - computer bugs, glitches, clerical errors If you take down a large corporation every time you find any of these, there will be no corporation left within a year. Just small companies that were statistically lucky to have neit…

They had this bug for more than a decade. They should have systems in place to look for these things. People make mistakes, but these mistakes should be caught before they get into production. And the ones that still make it into production should be hunted.

Should we discuss about all the 15 years old bugs that are found in Windows, Linux and MacOS which are well into production (and many of them critical bugs that affect the core of the product)? Has a software company ever been fined or held liable for bugs in its products? In fact too often, bug fixes are paid updates.

Financial companies are held to extraordinary standards, and in my opinion it's a game they cannot win.

Re: Citigroup fined $7m after legit transactions mistaken for test data for 15 years

#55

Post by [deleted] »

stickfigure wrote: post #49
DugFin wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, Martha Stewart is a prime example of how NOT to deal with the SEC. Turns out she wasn't guilty of insider trading, but she still went to jail for lying to the SEC about the trades in the first place. They take that very seriously.

This particular example seems to reinforce the argument for saying nothing at all .

[deleted]

Re: Citigroup fined $7m after legit transactions mistaken for test data for 15 years

#56

Post by arachnids »

kazinator wrote: post #27

Synopsis: SEC sends clear message to tech people in finance: shut the fuck up if you find something, silently fix it, and sweep the remaining crumbs under the rug, or else your company will be fined millions.

You realize the alternative is jail time for everyone who participated in the cover up? No amount of my company's money is worth my freedom.

Re: Citigroup fined $7m after legit transactions mistaken for test data for 15 years

#57

Post by ersii »

arachnids wrote: post #56
kazinator wrote: post #27

Synopsis: SEC sends clear message to tech people in finance: shut the fuck up if you find something, silently fix it, and sweep the remaining crumbs under the rug, or else your company will be fined millions.

You realize the alternative is jail time for everyone who participated in the cover up? No amount of my company's money is worth my freedom.

The less you know (or say that you know)...

Re: Citigroup fined $7m after legit transactions mistaken for test data for 15 years

#58

Post by [deleted] »

HighPlainsDrftr wrote: post #53
eli wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a school of thought that punitive fines should be a proportion of company value/earnings rather than an absolute dollar figure to exact an equal amount of discomfort. I think Finnish speeding fines are a percent of income.

I've thought long and hard about this for many years. Punitive damages - eg jail time or financial punishment should be removed from our system except in cases where people are unfit to be in society (like murders' etc). What should happen - all of the management at Citgroup should have to attend a 5 day training provided by the SEC showing how they can fix the reporting problems they have. How it causes problems to…

[deleted]

Re: Citigroup fined $7m after legit transactions mistaken for test data for 15 years

#59

Post by AWildDHHAppears »

rfurmani wrote: post #35
comp1927 wrote: post #26

//Try this in your console. function should_not_exclude_10B_10C(x) { if ("089" should_not_exclude_10B_10C("10B") should_not_exclude_10B_10C("10C")

Actually, no: ascii 10B>100. The bug above is that you can't do chained inequalities like that in Javascript. Try: should_not_exclude_10B_10C("200")

These could be IBM Mainframes that are EBCDIC based.

Re: Citigroup fined $7m after legit transactions mistaken for test data for 15 years

#60

Post by simonh »

stickfigure wrote: post #49
DugFin wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, Martha Stewart is a prime example of how NOT to deal with the SEC. Turns out she wasn't guilty of insider trading, but she still went to jail for lying to the SEC about the trades in the first place. They take that very seriously.

This particular example seems to reinforce the argument for saying nothing at all .

Directors of companies have legal responsibilities to provide these reports to the government. So instead of the company getting a fine for making a mistake even though you tried to comply, now you are personally choosing not to fulfil your legal obligations as a director. Smart move.
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