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I renounced my US citizenship

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Re: I renounced my US citizenship

#51
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really FATCA is one of the most excellent laws that has been passed. Prior to this, you had expats who had milked the US and then they wanted to waltz off with their proceeds. Americans gain huge benefits from the taxes paid by prior generations. The entire US system is the envy of much of the world--and how did it get that way? Americans paying their taxes. Whether or not you have kids--you must pay property taxes t…

>Americans gain huge benefits from the taxes paid by prior generations. The entire US system is the envy of much of the world--and how did it get that way? Americans paying their taxes. This always amuses me. Previous generations didn't pay for things with taxes. They paid with debt. All those (crumbling) things that are "the envy of much of the world"? I and people my age paid for, decades after they were built. Jus…

I see you're experiencing some cognitive dissonance. You can't understand how it could actually be fair for you to have to pay for the services that remain available to you as a holder of a United States passport. Funny, you're claiming that the US is such a hellhole--well some parts of it are but still, why oh why are so many people from around the world clamoring to get to the United States? Because its infrastructure is so corroded? I don't think so.

They want to come here because the United States--at its best--is a perfect example of the benefits that come when people pool their money together to pay for roads, electric and water utilities, the court system that enforces contracts and makes modern life and business possible, the FDA that allows you to feed your children without worry, the EPA that sometimes acts as a watchdog. All of these things come when the vast majority of Americans pool their tax dollars and pay for these things. So, if you are a US Citizen--who went to school here--then you have already benefitted from all these things and it is only just and proper that you now take your turn to contribute during your life. If you don't want to--by all means renounce! Ingrate!

So, seeing that you flatly oppose the idea of a public school system, reveals that you're just a closet anarchist who is such a sociopath that you don't even want kids educated. Hmm. What do you think happens to uneducated kids? They can't get jobs and they rob your house. So, your 'cant' "Why should I have to pay for your kids"--is an example of Low Effort Thinking. You have exposed yourself as a Low Effort Thinker. Don't be flattered. Your "ditch digger" comment was precisely on the level of stupidity as was Marie Antoinette's "let them eat cake" comment.

So, you admit to the long laundry list of things that the US government will do for you. That's enough. Is Portugal, for example, going to come to your aid in lieu of the US. Is Panama? No government at all is going to help you unless you pay them.

In case you hadn't noticed, states all exist within the United States. If the US Federal government keeps a standing army--then the US States benefit from its existence. If the States levy taxes that educate the citizens of their state--then the US Federal government benefits directly. The taxes paid to the Feds and the States are mutually beneficial: fungible. So, it is meaningless to claim these are "state" expenses that don't exist in the exact same place as the overall nation.

I find it quite amusing that you somehow believe that you have paid these vast sums in taxes. I'm sure you're a diligent tax dodger at every opportunity. So--do, please, renounce.

If you inherited your wealth then you're a parasite.

If you earned your wealth in the US, again you did not do it in a vacuum. If you started a company, then you tacitly benefitted in the extreme from the pooled taxes. No matter how much in taxes you paid, you gained many more times in benefits than you paid.

That's why, from the time of the Ancient Greeks, the concept of a progressive tax system, where the percentage paid in taxes increases as a taxpayer goes up the income scale, has been seen as fair. Ben Franklin himself personally worked twice to get this exact same progressive tax system implemented. He mentions his hard work and belief in the idea of a progressive tax system twice in his autobiography.

No, if your viewpoint just makes you look like another Low Effort Thinker.

Re: I renounced my US citizenship

#52

Charging for renunciation is the most ridiculous part. You are paying for a process that: is expensive only since they want to investigate you as a presumed criminal or tax dodger (the movie Brazil comes to mind) is a result of their non-compliance with international norms is the result of the US declaring you have a status that was never requested As an expat I consider all US citizens to be indentured servants due…

I'm curious, what is stopping expats with foreign citizenship and an objection to the paperwork from just letting their US passports expire (or for the "accidental americans" not ever establishing one) and just not complying with all the annoying rules?

Holding a passport is simply an indication of your citizenship, it is not considered the sole record of it. You can't fail to be a citizen by ignoring rules and not having the right piece of paper.

Re: I renounced my US citizenship

#53
post #26
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am really tired of this pro-pangada. It is so far from truth but one google search away from factcheck. Majority of the Federal government expenditure goes into Military/Social Security/Medicare. All of which can be substantially reduced. These three components cover more than 70% of total Federal spending. Out of this Medicare can be seen as taxing current generation to pay for the older generation. Almost all deb…

>Public schools in USA are the worst government institutions ever. They're also funded by state and local governments, so they're not really relevant to discussions about federal taxes.

The federal government subsidizes some public school programs. But they are heavily regulated by the department of education. Another federal agency that should be abolished.

http://blogs.census.gov/wp-content/blogs.dir/11/files/2012/0...

Re: I renounced my US citizenship

#54
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Americans gain huge benefits from the taxes paid by prior generations. The entire US system is the envy of much of the world--and how did it get that way? Americans paying their taxes. This always amuses me. Previous generations didn't pay for things with taxes. They paid with debt. All those (crumbling) things that are "the envy of much of the world"? I and people my age paid for, decades after they were built. Jus…

I see you're experiencing some cognitive dissonance. You can't understand how it could actually be fair for you to have to pay for the services that remain available to you as a holder of a United States passport. Funny, you're claiming that the US is such a hellhole--well some parts of it are but still, why oh why are so many people from around the world clamoring to get to the United States? Because its infrastruct…

>I see you're experiencing some cognitive dissonance.

I see you're not afraid to insert your foot at the very start.

>You can't understand how it could actually be fair for you to have to pay for the services that remain available to you as a holder of a United States passport.

What services could you possibly be talking about here? The holder of a US passport has exactly one service from the US government that's worth anything at all - the right to travel to the US.

>Funny, you're claiming that the US is such a hellhole...

So here is where I started skimming. If you're not going to respond to what I say, the book you've written here has little meaning.

But I did get a laugh out of this:

>If you inherited your wealth then you're a parasite.

Projection. If I've inherited my wealth (sadly, not true in my case), that's between me and my parents. People who think they have a right to other peoples' wealth because it exists and they want it are the parasites.

It's a shame The Daily Worker went out of business, or I'd know a reliable place to find this kind of drivel.

And BTW, a person who's entire political philosophy is based on envy doesn't have room at all to call anyone a Low Effort Thinker.

Re: I renounced my US citizenship

#55
Interesting. Although I have always just assumed that since I need a social security number to open any kind of account in the US that the IRS already knows how much I have in the bank.

>If US citizens living in the US had to report the balance of every account they had in their local bank — all their assets, in other words, not just their income — they would be up in arms, protesting the government’s intrusion in citizens’ private business.

Re: I renounced my US citizenship

#56
post #24

Her biggest complaint is that she has to report her overseas bank accounts. If she had done some basic research, she would have realized that this isn't specific to people residing outside the US, but any US national even within the US has to report foreign bank accounts with balances >$10k. The rest of her post reads like whining about having to fill out forms.

This is part of the reason I moved all my funds from my Indian account to my father and mother's account just because I dont want to feel 10 other forms.

I'm curious btw, what made you give up your Indian citizenship in the first place. Seems to me that an American citizenship isn't all that cracked up to be (if you already hold a GC, H1, etc).

Re: I renounced my US citizenship

#57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The author herself doesn't seem to be experiencing outrageous banking pain, though. She's paying no US taxes, and could almost certainly fill out her own tax forms if the thousand-Euro fee is onerous. It's completely unclear what, exactly, is so burdensome about her citizenship.

I would say her experience and stress of that experience are shown in her "Violation of Privacy" section. The final part "If they do not match, the US threatens excessively large fines, entirely out of proportion to the totals reported in those accounts, enough to wipe out one’s entire savings. Many banks, meanwhile, are beginning to refuse to do business with US citizens in order to lower their compliance costs." se…

In general the IRS does not come after you if you make what they think is an honest mistake. I have had several friends get a letter with a correct tax return and simply had to make up the difference.

Re: I renounced my US citizenship

#59
You complain about the US legal system, which based on the constitution protects everyone with due process rights, and like countries like the Netherlands which have no bill of rights? Me and my family spent our life savings, endured the horrors of leaving everything behind to come to the US to enjoy the liberty and rights that are guaranteed to everyone, yet people like you are not happy and want lower standards.

Good riddance. If you don't want to be a citizen of this great country, it would be better than you.

Re: I renounced my US citizenship

#60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also note that if the US does rescue you, then they also send you a bill for it. (It is capped at something like the price of a full fare economy plane ticket, which is still expensive.)

So, the State Department is supposed to maintain a worldwide set of consulates--with no charge to you--just so they can swoop in at your time of need and give you services that you then pay for. Do you think all those State Department resources just come out of pixie dust when you need them? Duh, no. We pay things called taxes to keep that worldwide network of consulates existing and available if you need them. No, l…

Your anger is uncalled for. There's a trivial solution. As leoedin points out at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11071749#up_11072396 :

> The UK embeds the cost of consular protection and embassy services into the renewal cost of a passport - approximately £15 in 2010, probably more now. It's an insurance payment that most people will never use, so it doesn't need to cost very much per person.

I would gladly pay an extra $30 for each passport renewal than pay my accountant $600 every year to tell the US I don't need to pay taxes on my $35K income. That would raise it from $135 to $160.

If you're going to complain that emigrants like me don't point the finger to "true culprits", then I can complain that people like you also never point out the true culprit - a messed up system at the State Department which requires taxpayers who never have and never will travel internationally to subsidize consulates so that emigrants like me can have a backup plan in case war ever comes to Sweden. The more equitable plan is to fund it through a passport fee so only those who may need those services, eg, tourists, business travelers, and yes, emigrants like me, pay for it.

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