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Concerns for global spread of Zika mean Rio de Janeiro Olympics must not proceed

harvardpublichealthreview.org

51–60 of 213 posts

Re: Concerns for global spread of Zika mean Rio de Janeiro Olympics must not proceed

#51

Serious question: Has anyone seen an article or study about the microcephaly effects on pregnancy where the main population studied was not in brazil? I have yet to see a study that links it to microcephaly for anyone who has not been in brazil for a long time. I realize the mosquito isn't common, but brazil also does things like: "secretly spray tons and tons of pesticide on their populus", etc. Given these are all…

The article linked in the original post refers to a retrospective analysis in French Polynesia (the source of the virus in Brazil) that found a huge increase in Zika-induced microcephaly there as well.

Re: Concerns for global spread of Zika mean Rio de Janeiro Olympics must not proceed

#52
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

talking on an iPhone, by yourself, especially late at night, then you're asking for trouble. Please don't apply your standards other cities of the world. What you described does not happen in my (capital) city. In fact if you drop something, you will likely get it back.

I'm not sure about the tone of that message, but I have lived in several cities where this was the case: Oslo, Singapore, Helsinki, Stockholm come to mind as places where even “dodgy” areas have had until recently very little instances of systematic robberies.

The chance to be involved in an armed robbery are small in every big city in the world. Based on anecdotes people will always over or under exaggerate the chances.

Just to give a counter example: I lived in Brussels, Philadelphia, Oslo, Sao Paulo... the only place about which I have a first hand "armed robbery" story was in Oslo of all places: a coworker got actually shot in the back when he bravely (but stupidly) turned his back and said "no, you are not going to shoot me".

He was lucky and was only a couple of weeks out but he carried his X-rays of the bullet with him because nobody would believe him otherwise.

Re: Concerns for global spread of Zika mean Rio de Janeiro Olympics must not proceed

#53
post #43
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a middle-income tourist who has had multiple holidays in Rio, the closest I've come to being robbed was by a taxi driver that wanted $200 to travel from Corcovado to Pao de Acucar. Seriously, it's like any other city in the world. If you walk around a dodgy area talking on an iPhone, by yourself, especially late at night, then you're asking for trouble. Be sensible and cautious, and Rio is a lovely place to go on…

Not that I don't agree with you... I do. But, being brazilian, the idea of walking around at any time with my iphone out makes me cringe. I love my country, and I think everyone should visit it, but just keep away your iphones and anything of value while walking about, and you'll be fine!

Yeah, I lived in BH - I have blonde hair, so I didn't need an iPhone to say I was a rich gringo.

Re: Concerns for global spread of Zika mean Rio de Janeiro Olympics must not proceed

#54

This article is idiotic if the main reason for cancelling the game is actually some "global spread" of Zika. Rio is not some city in the middle of nowhere from which no flights are coming in and out of, and now suddenly this massive international influx of visitors will come in -- it is a world-class city, a financial hub of the largest country in the continent. If we take London 2012 as a benchmark, estimates there…

I would expect the differences you mention to result in a higher delta for Rio, they would contribute to a lower base rate of travel making the event travel relatively larger.

Re: Concerns for global spread of Zika mean Rio de Janeiro Olympics must not proceed

#55

This article is idiotic if the main reason for cancelling the game is actually some "global spread" of Zika. Rio is not some city in the middle of nowhere from which no flights are coming in and out of, and now suddenly this massive international influx of visitors will come in -- it is a world-class city, a financial hub of the largest country in the continent. If we take London 2012 as a benchmark, estimates there…

London has the most tourists of any city in the world.

No, it's not the same.

Re: Concerns for global spread of Zika mean Rio de Janeiro Olympics must not proceed

#56
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is the FINANCIAL impact the biggest one to be considered?

Because it's an objective unit of measurement. You can't objectively measure (or assign a value to) human suffering.

It depends what you are measuring. If a city could increase its financial prosperity at the expense of poisoning its population (fracking may be a good example) would they do it? After all, if money is the only thing that matters then human health only matters insofar as it affects the flow of money. And if other factors compensate to preserve "financial health" then human health outcomes become expendable.

If you could produce more meat cheaper at the expense of keeping animals in terrible conditions on factory farms, would you do it? After all, if money is all that matters the animal's suffering doesn't even enter the equation.

How about increasing financial gain at the expense of destroying the natural environment (eg overfishing, dumping plastics and releasing all the carbon from the ground)? Grandchildren may have to pay the bill, but what if you had perfect knowledge and knew they'd be economically richer, but with worse health outcomes and lots of species gone exinct?

Measuring implies a model, and the model makes assumptions about the world that may not be true, and the whole combination can be extremely harmful. Not to mention very human-centric (and "us" centric). As the Native American chief said:

When the Last Tree Is Cut Down, the Last Fish Eaten, and the Last Stream Poisoned, You Will Realize That You Cannot Eat Money

Re: Concerns for global spread of Zika mean Rio de Janeiro Olympics must not proceed

#57
post #36

So does "fold" just mean "times"? I always thought it meant 2^x times.

Yes. It's quite commonly used in British English afaik. You can say "This brought a twofold increase in clientele", "We saw a threefold weight increase in affected mammals". I've never seen it used passed "fourfold" though.

"Tenfold" seems common enough.

Re: Concerns for global spread of Zika mean Rio de Janeiro Olympics must not proceed

#58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

talking on an iPhone, by yourself, especially late at night, then you're asking for trouble. Please don't apply your standards other cities of the world. What you described does not happen in my (capital) city. In fact if you drop something, you will likely get it back.

He said in a dodgy area . Pray tell what is this magical city you live in that does not have a single dodgy area.

I can't think of a place in Ottawa that I wouldn't feel comfortable wandering around late at night with my phone out.

Re: Concerns for global spread of Zika mean Rio de Janeiro Olympics must not proceed

#59
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is the FINANCIAL impact the biggest one to be considered?

Because it's an objective unit of measurement. You can't objectively measure (or assign a value to) human suffering.

Except that we do. We assign monetary values to human lives in actuarial models every day. The statistical value of a human live in the Netherlands when considering traffic safety was E700k in the last project I worked on, but this varies by purpose and over time. Furthermore, there are several international standard methods of quantifying the burden of disease, like the DALY and QALY.

So yes, we can and we do 'objectively' (as in, per a standardized methodology) assign value to human suffering.

Re: Concerns for global spread of Zika mean Rio de Janeiro Olympics must not proceed

#60
post #4
post #2

I think this is a stupid statement made by people that are not in Rio. I live a longtime in Rio and never had Dengue, Zika or whatever.. right now it's cold in Rio de Janeiro so mosquitos are dead or dying, how are you going to get Zika with dead mosquitos right now? Stupids and racists from Harvard, search more references first!

Your anecdotal evidence is much more valuable than a report put out by the world's top university. Thanks!

This is exactly what I mean, it's just like have the top media company saying anything and the society just accepts it and period!

I'm not saying that there's no Zika, I'm just saying that there's more of a "ohhh.. everybody is going to get it!" then anything else...

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