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Apple's Push to Flood India with Used iPhones Ignites Backlash

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Re: Apple's Push to Flood India with Used iPhones Ignites Backlash

#51

Post by shripadk »

samastur wrote: post #48
shripadk wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That policy is for a first-hand phone. Does the same policy continue for a second-hand phone (which is basically "refurbish them for use")?

Where does it say that? You seem to be set against this so under what conditions could Apple (or anybody else) sell refurbished phones that would be acceptable to you? Or do they become problem immediately once they are not new?

Does Apple state that the recycling policy applies to any phone irrespective of how many hands has been changed in the process?

Would you be willing to buy a second hand refurbished phone from Apple if the recycling policy does not apply for the second hand phone?

Re: Apple's Push to Flood India with Used iPhones Ignites Backlash

#52

Post by arihant »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #24
simula67 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Foreign policy is not decided based on consistency. Every democratic government has a responsibility to defend it's own citizen's interests. USA does this also, it wants free trade when it wants to export goods and services to other nations but opposes it when it comes to importing labor ( H1B VISA cap etc ). This is not evil, it is this competition between nations that improves standard of living for people everywhe…

Opposes the importation of labor? Inspite of importing more high-end labor than almost any other country? How can they be opposed to it?

Well it's not about quantity but attitude. India might be the leading importer of a lot of things given the population. But that doesn't negate the defensive attitude towards imports.

Re: Apple's Push to Flood India with Used iPhones Ignites Backlash

#53

Post by ocean3 »

coldtea wrote: post #27
vacri wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meh. Apple is asking to be treated like a special snowflake in this case, caught by their own elitism of not-selling-affordable-phones.

> caught by their own elitism of not-selling-affordable-phones. Yeah, and look where that got them. From near bankruptcy in 1997 to being only the most valuable (or in top 3 depending on when you look/how you measure) of companies on the planet.

But that strategy did not work for them in India. Hence they are trying to sell cheaper refurbished models.

Re: Apple's Push to Flood India with Used iPhones Ignites Backlash

#54

Post by anexprogrammer »

planetjones wrote: post #12

There's something deeply contradictory in India's attitude. For imports (including setting up supermarkets in India) there are levys, laws and regulations to make it almost impossible for foreign companies. But then India is able to export its IT professionals and outsourcing across the whole world. Is this really a level playing field? Why is no one calling this out as foul play? India seems to want one rule for whe…

I take your point, but India is not exactly unique here.

To name but two, China has similar one-sided regulations and Switzerland has companies that can aggressively mount hostile takeovers of foreign competition, whilst being effectively protected from same (Nestles being the obvious example).

Contradictory attitudes seem quite common!

Re: Apple's Push to Flood India with Used iPhones Ignites Backlash

#55

Post by arihant »

I don't see how this helps Apple. They offered cheaper versions with 8GB ROMs in India before. It backfired because though they were cheap it was a shitty experience. With iOS 9 underperforming even on iPhone 5S, I don't see how this more will do anything but tarnish Apple image further.

Indian customers do not want to spend less. They want to spend as much as they can but expect longevity and quality. Historically Apple has provided that.

Apple's iPhone 5S is 20K in India. Fairly affordable for an iPhone. If they are selling refurbished, they are trying to probably nibble at Moto G buyers. Even if they succeed, they are not a segment that is expected to exceedingly spend on App Stores or iCloud storage. That is the segment expecting things like Bluetooth file transfer. That is the segment not paying 1500/month for a decent plan which has enough LTE.

All of Apple's moves these days are operational. It almost seems like COO has a complete run of the brand. Move the inventory. That's all that matters.

Re: Apple's Push to Flood India with Used iPhones Ignites Backlash

#56

Post by sokoloff »

shripadk wrote: post #51
samastur wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where does it say that? You seem to be set against this so under what conditions could Apple (or anybody else) sell refurbished phones that would be acceptable to you? Or do they become problem immediately once they are not new?

Does Apple state that the recycling policy applies to any phone irrespective of how many hands has been changed in the process? Would you be willing to buy a second hand refurbished phone from Apple if the recycling policy does not apply for the second hand phone?

Since the alternative would be "there is no market for reuse of once-used phone", the recycling policy would not deter me. Apple as a seller and I as a buyer are making the world better by providing a secondary market for high-level re-use rather than component/elemental level recycling or landfilling.

IOW, the recycling policy DOES apply, IMO, even if there is no downstream from my use recycling intent (which I think is still an open question from the text and the overall good results Apple gets on recycling).

As a US consumer, I generally buy and use 13-18 month old iPhones until they no longer reliably function or until the battery life is too poor, then I go buy another one-generation old phone. Apple has nothing to do with this, other than keeping the upgrade treadmill going for everyone else so I can get my $200-250 used phones to put on an MVNO (Ting in my case).

Re: Apple's Push to Flood India with Used iPhones Ignites Backlash

#57

Post by seanmcdirmid »

nkoren wrote: post #44
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Opposes the importation of labor? Inspite of importing more high-end labor than almost any other country? How can they be opposed to it?

> Inspite of importing more high-end labor than almost any other country? On a per-capita basis, I don't believe this is anywhere nere correct.

On a per capita basis, any rich country in the Middle East or city state in SE Asia that imports all its workers wins by default. But out of the major economies, the USA is at least up there with Europe per cap, and definitely in raw numbers.

Re: Apple's Push to Flood India with Used iPhones Ignites Backlash

#58

Post by seanmcdirmid »

arihant wrote: post #52
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Opposes the importation of labor? Inspite of importing more high-end labor than almost any other country? How can they be opposed to it?

Well it's not about quantity but attitude. India might be the leading importer of a lot of things given the population. But that doesn't negate the defensive attitude towards imports.

There are a lot of people in the USA, some don't like immigration and are particularly loud about it, but they are nowhere in the majority, and definitely not the politicians who are in power making all the rules.

Re: Apple's Push to Flood India with Used iPhones Ignites Backlash

#59

Post by seanmcdirmid »

shripadk wrote: post #34
planetjones wrote: post #12

There's something deeply contradictory in India's attitude. For imports (including setting up supermarkets in India) there are levys, laws and regulations to make it almost impossible for foreign companies. But then India is able to export its IT professionals and outsourcing across the whole world. Is this really a level playing field? Why is no one calling this out as foul play? India seems to want one rule for whe…

Being an Indian I can also get work outsourced to a developer in a foreign country without having to pay any duty. There are many companies in India that also employ foreign nationals. How can you compare import/export of physical goods with import/export of services/labor? Both are different. EDIT: Also you are assuming Apple does not have retail stores in India. In fact there are multiple Apple stores in every city…

Apple doesn't have stores in India. Those are Indian-owned retailers licensed to sell Apple products. Indian law won't allow Apple to open their own stores in India like they have done in China.

Apple would only sell second hand phones on India if their was a market for them.

Re: Apple's Push to Flood India with Used iPhones Ignites Backlash

#60

Post by sandGorgon »

planetjones wrote: post #25
brainless wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand what you are saying, but I think it is not true. Being an Indian and having lived there for 30+ years, I can hardly list any major international brand in any industry which isn't selling something there. Also all the big international brands are also big Indian brands, most people do not even care that they are not Indian owned brands. So yes, huge amounts of foreign brands sell in India, but perhaps wit…

"We shall not entertain foreign direct investment in multibrand retail. There is no ambiguity or confusion on this. The same applies to e-commerce," the minister said in a news conference. http://www.wsj.com/articles/india-wont-allow-foreign-investm...

This has not to due with manufacturing, but around government protecting the small shops against Walmart. What you may not know is that Walmart is operating in India but as a partner with the Tata group.

The same applies to insurance, lending and banking business. So the brands we have are Tata-Starbucs, Bharti-Axa, Birla-Sunlife, etc.

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