I recently quit Facebook because I wanted avoid the state of permanent outrage that platform has come to feed off. Some random guy says something reprehensible and we're all suppose apply their comment to an entire group and get into a discussion about said generalized group. Rinse and repeat. It's old and pointless. HN is way better than this.
SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’
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Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’
#52I don't want to see homeless people, drug deals, vomiting drunks, or pantless vagrants on my commute to work either. Does that make me heartless? I would hope not because otherwise these problems are not going to be solved. You need people who do NOT want to see that kind of crap on a daily basis to do something about it.
But the reason why people don't want to see them affects the outcome.
If it's (at least partly) from compassion for people reduced to such circumstances, hopefully the solution will go some way to improving their lot.
But if it's purely from indignation at the inconvenience suffered by the observers, then the "solution" may simply involve shifting the problem elsewhere: viz. Keller's approval of the way the "homeless and other riff raff" temporarily vanished during the Super Bowl.
Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’
#53Any data to back this up? Can't really go on anecdotal stories or EMS accounts (who only see emergency situations by design).
Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’
#54To play devil's advocate, he's right. He shouldn't have to see the pain, struggle, and despair of homeless - the city government should be providing affordable housing and shelters for the homeless. That it hasn't is a failure of the local government, and should be addressed. Much of the reason that affordable housing is out of reach of many in San Francisco is due to government regulation, not market capitalism. Ext…
>To play devil's advocate, he's right. He shouldn't have to see the pain, struggle, and despair of homeless - the city government should be providing affordable housing and shelters for the homeless.
Only if people agree, offer their solidarity, and approve the city government of doing so (with their taxes etc too).
Which is exactly what people like him don't allow.
Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’
#55It's ironic that Keller will get so much shit dumped on him for making the same exact argument that people make against more permissive immigration. Compare:
A: Allowing people trapped in unproductive countries to move to US/Canada/Europe would significantly improve their quality of life.
B: But think of burden to the welfare state! We wouldn't be able to afford the flood of people moving here for benefits.
A: Simple, just don't allow them benefits. Many people would still move to US/Canada/Europe even if excluded completely from the social safety net (or voting, etc.).
B: The thought of so many destitute people being in my country and not receiving help makes me uncomfortable.
The predominant attitude people hold toward the poor/disadvantaged outside their country is no different than Keller's: I simply do not want to be confronted with this. I'd prefer to not see it and pretend it wasn't there.
(Please do not take this as an argument for open borders, it is just an attempt to highlight a hypocrisy.)
Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’
#56I think he does have a point... but he could have put it better. I live in SF too; for ~10 years. I have never seen it this bad. The City passed a "sit/lie" law a couple of years ago.. but it's never enforced. The City is spending $1M/month ... for housing 225 people[1]. Do the math, and you'll see how ridiculous is that. At that rate, how much do you think the City can spend on the homeless? It has 7000 homeless, an…
>You can't force them to use detox clinics, etc. Maybe it is not possible yet legally, but why shouldn't we allow this? The courts can already force people to be commited for mental afflictions when they are a danger to themselves or others. Why not do the same for (heavy) drug addicts who start becoming a liability?
Forced mental treatment has been the source of a great many atrocities by the state over the decades.
Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’
#57What is a "SF tech bro"? In this context it seems to be intended as some kind of slur, or there is at least some negative connotation here. It's a man who works in tech who... what exactly?
It means a non-"progressive" White male who works in technology.
Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’
#58It is a strange situation to see lavish tech offices with homeless people sleeping on sidewalks. One minute you'll be making your way through tents set up on sidewalks and the next you'll be inside a plush cafeteria with an endless supply of free food. It's a shocking contrast.
Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’
#59To play devil's advocate, he's right. He shouldn't have to see the pain, struggle, and despair of homeless - the city government should be providing affordable housing and shelters for the homeless. That it hasn't is a failure of the local government, and should be addressed. Much of the reason that affordable housing is out of reach of many in San Francisco is due to government regulation, not market capitalism. Ext…
Not sure what kind of solution the government should have.
There's already a myriad of local, state and federal housing programs already in place. Whether its temporary emergency housing, eviction protection, child care services, or in some cases, low income housing and federal subsidies for permanent housing.
There's plenty of safety nets in California, let alone the SF area. If people want to get off the streets, there's an abundance of resources at their disposal. Saying the government isn't doing enough is a bit myopic considering all the local, state and federal help readily available.
http://sf-moh.org/index.aspx?page=130
https://www.mercyhousing.org/california
http://www.homeless.org.au/directory/us-california.htm
http://www.freeprintshop.org/download/shelter_english.pdf
http://www.sfcenter.org/resources/housing
http://portal.hud.gov/hudportal/HUD?src=/states/california/h...
http://ssa.ocgov.com/calfresh/calworks/emergency/homeless
http://www.needhelppayingbills.com/html/calworks_homeless_as...
And that's JUST for the homeless services. It doesn't even START to address the free addiction clinics, low cost prescriptions, free health care clinics, food shelves, and other resources homeless people might need help to get off the streets.
In my mind the government is going way above and beyond trying to solve this issue.
Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’
#60What is a "SF tech bro"? In this context it seems to be intended as some kind of slur, or there is at least some negative connotation here. It's a man who works in tech who... what exactly?
"Bro" has become a generic term for a young man with an inflated sense of self worth, a low opinion of others, a macho attitude, and a loud voice. Think of a stereotypical fraternity member.