Should kids learn to code? • Hacker News Board

Re: Should kids learn to code?

#51

Post by fucking_tragedy » Fri, Dec 04, 2015, 9:35 PM UTC

pinn4242 wrote: post #49

steven2012 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not just learning a language. It's a tool to allow you to build computer applications. Some people simply aren't interested in building apps, just like some people aren't interested in playing music or throwing/catching a football.

Where did we get to apps? How about just command line? I'm not sure if you create apps for your job, but that's not all of programming. I work on an "app" for my job, but it's a more-or-less vertical. I really don't see how teaching a child some command line or REPL (read execute print loop) stuff threatens my job. Even if that child is in India or something. I'm secure in my own abilities.

Is knowing any of that necessary in today's world? Command of the English language is needed to function in our society and neglecting to teach a child the subject has obvious lifelong negative repercussions.

Most happy and successful people will never care about typing commands into a glorified calculator.

Re: Should kids learn to code?

#52

Post by malux85 » Fri, Dec 04, 2015, 11:39 PM UTC

pmilot wrote: post #16

malux85 wrote: post #2

Yes, even if they're not going to become programmers, coding teaches people two important skills that I see lacking: - The ability to break up large, seemingly daunting problems into smaller manageable chunks. - The ability to shift perspectives from the 50,000 foot view, down to the individual line of code view, and then back up to the 50,000 foot view, and then back down again! Variances in individuals abilities ca…

I agree that these are two very important skills, but I have yet to see a "Learn to code" endeavour that actually focuses on teaching these skills. Usually, these are more focused on I/O and making the machine output interesting things like visual charts and sounds (something that is more immediately satisfying and therefore keeps the student's attention).

Excellent point. There's got to be a sweet spot between visually interesting and "symbolically" useful (maybe algorithmically is a better word there)

I tried a rather ham-fisted restaurant menu example below, but that's boring as hell. I wonder if there's something better?

I really think a nice simple language like Python is a good choice - python has a few WTFs for beginners, but the more immediate visual niche languages give immediate payoff (good) but then later their impracticality re-enforces to the child that learning it was a fun intellectual exercise but ultimately useless.

Challenge: Whats the shortest, simplest, most appealing python program we could use to teach kids? I dont know the answer to that, but it's fun to think about :)

Re: Should kids learn to code?

#53

Post by baldfat » Sat, Dec 05, 2015, 1:42 AM UTC

tracker1 wrote: post #46

baldfat wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yes if it interests them. No if not. If you do that with food you have a grown person eating Chicken Nuggets and Mac & Cheese for life and not know the awesome food that is around them.

Kids tend to be naturally curious and want to help... let them help, even if it slows you down. If you cook and let them help, when they are young, they will learn. And yes, some people as adults only eat chicken nuggets and mac and cheese... though to be fair, I spent two years perfecting my mac and cheese skills (baking vs. stove top, bechamel route vs sodium citrate, sauce and cheese variations) making it about ev…

Kids are natural scientist and we always screw that up. BUT pushing them to try new things is also super important.

Re: Should kids learn to code?

#54

Post by js8 » Wed, Dec 09, 2015, 5:32 PM UTC

jfaucett wrote: post #15

I disagree with this. I feel like the general idea of "learning to code" is simply typing commands into a machine that then get executed exactly. The coding part teaches very little, just mainly how dumb machines are compared to self-aware human beings. Kids should definately learn how to think algorithmically and understand mathematics/physics concepts (as opposed to repeating some pattern recognition which is to of…

> I feel like the general idea of "learning to code" is simply typing commands into a machine that then get executed exactly.

But isn't that how every skill begins? With doing very simple things, by the book?

Like in your examples:

building things - cutting out preprinted paper models and gluing the pieces

playing music - playing scales over and over again

reading & writing - reading and writing simple sentences over and over

I don't know any skill where you just "jump" to creativity. It all takes time and effort, during which you actually learn the patterns.

I think coding is worth learning for a simple reason - computers are pervasive and universal tools, therefore to know how to talk to them is a part of universal literacy, just like reading, writing and arithmetic.