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EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

patrick-breyer.de

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Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#491

Post by pohuing »

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #390
pohuing wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

We seem to be good at combining the worst of both sides -> rightwing trickle down economics, left-wing social policy plus boomerism sprinkled on top

I quite like my left wing social policy. It's benefited me greatly and the more desperate even more so. Sure I now pay more tax than I would in the US, but my school was free, my university education was practically free, when I got diagnosed with chronic disease, the process of diagnosis was free and even expedient as it was an emergency.

My friends are allowed to be as queer as they want to be, and those who don't want to see them are free to look away.

Those with mental issues are free from destitution as their employers weren't free to just fire them.

The state should work for the most people to live the most comfortable life possible. We would have the money for it, if it weren't for the trickle down virus that's still infected half our politicians.

And I can't in good conscience judge anyone for coming here, I would do the same and would want to be treated well as well. Not be put in a concentration camp paid for by the EU, or get my dinky shot by Frontex at high sea, just before reaching the border.

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#492

Post by shangofox »

zelphirkalt wrote: post #321
mrtksn wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then I'm not very moved about this. I always assumed that anything unencrypted is scanned one way or another. What I care is not having a backdoor for E2E, i.e. like client-side scanning telling me what I am allowed to talk about like with the LLMs. CSAM excuse is a great excuse to turn every conversation to what we have with AI today.

If reading messages that are not for ones eyes is OK, then it is a much smaller step to the next level, which is to also being able to read encrypted messages. Slowly boiling the frog.

But the next level IS the chat control 2.0 and yes it is the one people should be concerned about. But it's not like this is unprecedented this is literally just an extension of something that existed.

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#493

Post by mattstir »

Fredkin wrote: post #147

Maybe a dumb question, but what's to stop people from communicating e2e encrypted over totally insecure channels using steganography techniques? You don't need a special app to do this, or maybe you just need a companion app that you type your message into and it gives you the thing you just paste into whatever messaging app / social media you use. The steganography makes it hard for the operator to determine that yo…

> or on the fly using stable diffusion

Steganography fundamentally requires you to be able to know where the data is, which requires you to have the original image to compare against. The only other strategy I'm aware of is setting known pixel positions to exact data, which is very easy for basic tools to spot and decode. Or to add the data to non-visual data blocks if the image format supports those, which is also quite easy to spot.

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#494

Post by aliasxneo »

BeetleB wrote: post #489
aliasxneo wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least I have still have a 2nd amendment - and, at least for now, still post on social media without getting a knock on my door.

> and, at least for now, still post on social media without getting a knock on my door. That's called "luck". A friend of mine did likewise, and got a knock, then handcuffs, then a trial. He was acquitted because everything he said was allowed under the first amendment. In fact, several academics had published the same/similar stuff he did and not had any problems (or ever worried about them). But he was of the wrong…

> That's called "luck".

I think it's actually called statistics. In 2026, it would seem I'm statistically less likely to get arrested for a social media post in the US than the UK. I mean it's not like the reason is hidden. Arrests typically require crossing into narrow unprotected categories under the First Amendment: true threats (Virginia v. Black standard), incitement to imminent lawless action (Brandenburg v. Ohio), or specific crimes like credible harassment, cyberstalking, or extortion.

It's quite a bit different than the UK's hate speech laws and the comparative result makes complete sense.

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#495

Post by [deleted] »

hintymad wrote: post #398
teekert wrote: post #38

This is a nice piece of democracy right here: "a measure it had rejected twice in March. Although a majority of voting Members of the European Parliament (MEPs) actually opposed the regulation (314 against, 276 in favor, 17 abstentions), the motion to reject it failed to secure the required absolute majority of 361 votes. As a result, mass scanning is now permitted again until 2028." "Oh no we can't get a majority to…

Honest question: when Europeans give so much power to EU and usually favor regulations by the government, isn't it natural that the government will try to implement more control? And it looks EU officials do not have to accountable for anything. They will not suffer personally even when their policies wreck havoc. I don't quite understand why Europeans can trust EU at all. Case in point, EU HQs shut down its air cond…

[deleted]

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#496

Post by BeetleB »

aliasxneo wrote: post #494
BeetleB wrote: post #489

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and, at least for now, still post on social media without getting a knock on my door. That's called "luck". A friend of mine did likewise, and got a knock, then handcuffs, then a trial. He was acquitted because everything he said was allowed under the first amendment. In fact, several academics had published the same/similar stuff he did and not had any problems (or ever worried about them). But he was of the wrong…

> That's called "luck". I think it's actually called statistics. In 2026, it would seem I'm statistically less likely to get arrested for a social media post in the US than the UK. I mean it's not like the reason is hidden. Arrests typically require crossing into narrow unprotected categories under the First Amendment: true threats (Virginia v. Black standard), incitement to imminent lawless action (Brandenburg v. Oh…

Luck is statistical :-)

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#497

Post by mattstir »

pmontra wrote: post #53

> apps that are safe by design for children How do we design such apps? Let's rule out age attestation (to allow only some age ranges) or scan of content because they are orthogonal to apps. What are the design patterns that prevent adults to meet kids? No messaging?

Depending on the app, you could also get away with limited messaging such as a wheel of predefined callouts in a team game.

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#498

Post by shangofox »

BSDobelix wrote: post #31
Y-bar wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Multiple things can be true at the same time. There can exist strong consumer protections against misuse of their personal data by various entities. And there can simultaneously also exist governmental overreach against citizens private data. The world is complex, few things are truly binary.

But now you have governmental overreach and legalized spying on European Citizens by (mostly) US Companies, so i would say that Law is truly binary bad. Also how the Law was forced is extremely bad. But hey it's once more proof that the EU is not a democratically spirited institution.

Except it isn't "now" it was a thing since covid.

And it's not overreach it's kinda more of a loose exception to the GDPR which actually allows companies to read messages. Which they would already do without GDPR

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#500

Post by shangofox »

monssooon wrote: post #476

To me as a European, this is not only about the dystopia that is becoming the tech survailance of society but it is a perfect example of what I feel the EU is. It is a disgusting dysfunctional institution that should have never been created in my opinion. This is what we have... Unelected bureaucrats using every opportunistic tool they can to, in my opinion get rid of democracy. What are we fighting for at this point…

As a European shouldn't you know this is just a renewal and nothing new. The weird voting system applies too.
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