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Honda is killing its EVs

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Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#491

Post by bluGill »

shiroiuma wrote: post #385
jacquesm wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I live in a top EV market, Norway. It is the top EV market. > I figure most other countries will be the same. Most other countries are not Norway, it is a very wealthy, tiny market (150 K vehicles/year) with lots of hydro and not representative of the typical vehicle market in Western Europe and definitely not representative of the situation in the rest of the world. EVs are the future, there is no doubt about that…

>But that future will not arrive everywhere at the same point in time and Norway is very far ahead of the rest of the world due to a fairly unique set of circumstances: exporting your own oil and gas to be able to have a 'clean' (and up to recently heavily subsidized) transportation network is in a way just a gigantic bookkeeping trick. Not really. Even in a hypothetical future where all road vehicles are electric, w…

Cars are the vast majortity of oil use though. The rest is more than a rounding error but not much more.

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#492

Post by pclowes »

Everyone is saying EVs are the future but most EVs cannot compete with many of Honda’s offerings.

Eg. I need to move 6 people and significant gear (skiing, camping, biking etc) long remote distances.

There is no EV that can do that really. And the ones that come close are easily $20-30k higher than an Odyssey. Plus the durability of large EVs is far from proven while the 300k mile club of Odyssey owners is large.

I need Suburban/Minivan functionality out of a proven OEM at a competitive price point. (I also need to see my friends with Rivians etc not having to schedule their vacation around charger availability. Have seen this waste hours and hours of time)

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#493

Post by lmm »

Slow_Hand wrote: post #232
TremendousJudge wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

isn't that at least partially caused by the rubber tire particles?

Could be! I don't know enough to say what the ratio of exhaust to tire particulate is on the average road. In either case it's a good physical representation of how much particulate we are exposed to every day. Maybe having it trapped in dirty snowbanks is better than having it getting kicked up into the air during a dryer season.

If it's particulates from tires then heavier EVs are probably making that worse not better (partially offset by regenerative braking, but only partially).

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#494

Post by rossjudson »

neya wrote: post #462
slg wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>you're buying a vehicle that already has the capabilities, but are disabled, then paying rent (or a fee) to turn them on. This is very much not what "software-defined vehicle" means which itself is very much not the same thing as EVs. It's possible to criticize the explotative business practices you mentioned (or bad UI practices like moving everything to a touchscreen instead of physical buttons) without linking th…

> At a societal level, EVs are generally better than ICE cars. Cite your sources, please > cars that can automatically fix a "recall" with an over-the-air update are generally better than recalls that will wait to get fixed until an owner schedules an appointment to have the car serviced. If a "recall" can be fixed via software, doesn't that mean just shitty software to begin with? And that usually happens only when…

Cite your own sources that they're not. And maybe try to avoid the ten year old nonsense that's frequently floated as "evidence".

On recalls -- like the one that said that individual icons have to be slightly bigger? Yeah, shitty software.

Or the one that made Tesla annoy drivers with a smaller timeout? That was actually a safety issue --- people would turn off FSD to adjust something and then turn it back on again. Much, much less safe.

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#495

Post by mayama »

direwolf20 wrote: post #444
ggm-at-algebras wrote: post #349

In Shenzhen for a tech meeting. The streetscape is quieter, despite high traffic levels and I hear not only MORE birdsong, but the birds do more complex songlines. The air is clean. For sure some of this is because it's a coastal city and has fresh sea breezes, but I've been in other Chinese coastal cities in times past and the air was significantly less clean. There are social upsides for an almost-all-EV city. This…

[flagged]

Liberal arts, Hollywood and the associated soft power, increasingly prevalent onlyf___ etc.

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#496

Post by rossjudson »

pclowes wrote: post #492

Everyone is saying EVs are the future but most EVs cannot compete with many of Honda’s offerings. Eg. I need to move 6 people and significant gear (skiing, camping, biking etc) long remote distances. There is no EV that can do that really. And the ones that come close are easily $20-30k higher than an Odyssey. Plus the durability of large EVs is far from proven while the 300k mile club of Odyssey owners is large. I n…

So an EV is not for you! You just might be one of the unlucky 1% for whom that is true.

Congratulate yourself on visiting nature while simultaneously messing it up. And enjoy the fuel prices.

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#497

Post by defrost »

AlotOfReading wrote: post #484
jtbayly wrote: post #386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve never had a software-based danger on my hardware-based vehicles. As such, there is a whole class of recalls that I never needed: all the ones you tell me I’m missing out on.

I'm impressed that you're daily driving what must be a 30+ year old vehicle. What model? Most enthusiasts have another vehicle to keep the miles down and use when the antique needs maintenance.

1990 AU Ford Falcon family here - still in near showroom condition (well, looks good but has a scratch and a minor ding) with ~ 600,000 km on the clock.

> when the antique needs maintenance.

You're talking about all the 1920s, 1930s, 1940s, et al cars, tracks and tractors that litter our district? Yeah - there are a lot of them in this part of the world.

All the farmers love the bleeding edge gear and are getting into AgBot boom sprayers, etc - but they still can't shake a love of keeping the really old stuff going - pimped up rat-trucks abound and we rebuilt an old Alice Chambers tractor ourselves two years back.

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#498

Post by chii »

slg wrote: post #415
metaphor wrote: post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's all motherhood and apple pie, but I'm sorry: the reality that we live in and incentives at play are such that if a capability can be exploited, then it will be exploited to the detriment of the consumer. Full stop.

It's interesting how many complaints I see on HN that are framed as if they're complaints about a specific piece of technology when they are really complaints about capitalism. I'm all ears if you want to criticize our entire economic system, but I think it's silly to have that conversation specifically in the context of car software rather than at a societal level.

> when they are really complaints about capitalism

it's not a complaint about capitalism. It's a complaint about asymmetric bargaining power in the seller/buyer relationship.

That's not inherent in capitalism. It's inherent in an anti-competitive market. The failure is in gov't making sure there's sufficient regulation to prevent monopolistic practises.

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#499

Post by bluGill »

p1necone wrote: post #158
Night_Thastus wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Long time before our electrical systems to be able to compensate for that kind of whole sale change. Will be at least 20 years if it ever happens. There's little to no reason that the electrical grid itself needs to change for the sake of EV's. The biggest problem is that while slow charging (L2) in your own garage would be perfect for 99%+ of people in the US, and isn't even very expensive, that's a barrier to entr…

> The biggest problem is that while slow charging (L2) in your own garage would be perfect for 99%+ of people in the US, and isn't even very expensive, that's a barrier to entry most people do not want to screw with. I feel like this is only an opinion that people who have never actually used an EV have. Plugging in my car overnight at home every few days is infinitely more convenient than needing to drive somewhere…

I leval 1 charge my car and that is always enough. Salesmen who sold it to me says he does the same. It depends on your commute, (i typically ride my bike if the weather isn't too bad) and the other trips you make (why I bought it - there is a once a week trip I make outside of bike range)

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#500

Post by leftytak »

Eva are great until you have the replace the battery. Then you’ll finally realize the real cost of owning an EV.

Once people realize that, then the game is over. Honda is just forecasting the future more accurately than other automakers.

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