Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

daringfireball.net

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

491–500 of 664 posts

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#491

Post by socalgal2 »

drdaeman wrote: post #296
foooorsyth wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve said several times before that notifications should be reportable as spam directly to Google/Apple, just like email spam reporting. Google tried to tackle this with notification channels, but the onus falls on the developer to actually use them honestly. No company trying to draw attention back to their app with advertisement notifications will willingly name a notification channel “advertisements” or “user re-e…

There should be a public API, open to any user-designated program (including self-made, without requiring any special hoops to obtain any fancy entitlements), that can act as a "firewall" for all notifications (except, possibly, for few system-critical ones), allowing it to control and modify those as it seems fit.

Sounds great! Until your grandpa downloads a notification filter than really just forwards all his notifications to the bad guys so they can hack all his accounts

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#492

Post by kridsdale3 »

rjst01 wrote: post #444
tomComb wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can sympathize. I don’t know about uber in particular but it gets quite tiring trying to find and follow these obscure settings. And what’s worse is that the companies always seem to find a way to reset it to what they want quite frequently. One of their tricks is to reorganize permissions frequently so the ones that allow their spam to get through are always new.

I had to completely turn off notifications for Instagram because none of the provided settings appear to disable the almost-daily "for you" and "trending" notifications. Now I don't get notified when someone DMs me there, which has lead to me missing important messages.

Same. And I used to work there, and I raised it with them. They have all their career incentives aligned to getting people to see spammy notifications. I was powerless.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#493

Post by kridsdale3 »

madeofpalk wrote: post #387
t8sr wrote: post #248

I have never said and rarely thought this before, but I really hope the person who came up with / approved this idea got fired for it. It’s rare that you see something so unbelievably stupid and destructive of the shared pool of trust, which Apple spent 30 years building, only for one self-interested PM to blow a chunk of it up for no gain. If the person who came up with this reads this site, I hope they see this com…

> destructive of the shared pool of trust Will there actually be any short, mediumm, or long term consequences for Apple? What real, tangible trust has Apple lost that could lead to meaningful harm to them? The only thing I can come up with is people who hold Apple to some kind of high-minded ideal, that they constantly run foul of for other reasons already.

Apple does a lot of things that are not allowed by any of the 3p developers. Someone like EU could look at that (for instance in this case a direct to consumer marketing channel that they are using to favor their own properties) and say it violates the DMA.

Google is being forced to take Google Flights links out of Search results, for instance.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#494

Post by netsharc »

dreamcompiler wrote: post #390
drdaeman wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There should be a public API, open to any user-designated program (including self-made, without requiring any special hoops to obtain any fancy entitlements), that can act as a "firewall" for all notifications (except, possibly, for few system-critical ones), allowing it to control and modify those as it seems fit.

Precisely this. There needs to be an API that all apps have to use not only for notifications but also for getting your contacts, your phone's location, etc. that is spoofable by the user. Or better yet, an AI program that runs entirely on the phone and does the spoofing automatically and entirely on behalf of the user. Let the enshittified apps' ads interact with your AI agent and steal your fake "data" in the backg…

On Android such a spoof app existed, it can hook into seemingly any API call and return things you control: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dt50HWys1k&t=27s

But of course you need a rooted phone, and rooted phones can't run banking apps, tap-to-pay, Netflix, Pokemon Go, blah blah..

The notification "firewall" is probably not impossible to make. I use Pushbullet, it mirrors notifications to my computer (to the browser extension to be exact), and I can already dismiss notifications coming into my phone from the computer. It should be possible to make an app that intercepts all notifications, analyzes their contents and dismiss them if they're spam...

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#495

Post by valleyjo »

em500 wrote: post #129

Apple Wallet is in the App store, and the F1 ad debacle directly violates App Store guidelines https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/ ) > 4.5.4 Push Notifications must not be required for the app to function, and should not be used to send sensitive personal or confidential information. Push Notifications should not be used for promotions or direct marketing purposes unless customers have explicitly…

Uber does this all the time to me. It’s so frustrating. I allow notifications from uber when I don’t from most apps because they are useful when a ride is incoming. Yet I get random spam notifications. I wish Apple would stand up for their own rules and do something about it but since they don’t even enforce this rule on themselves what hope is there

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#496

Post by moffkalast »

aqme28 wrote: post #130
em500 wrote: post #129

Apple Wallet is in the App store, and the F1 ad debacle directly violates App Store guidelines https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/ ) > 4.5.4 Push Notifications must not be required for the app to function, and should not be used to send sensitive personal or confidential information. Push Notifications should not be used for promotions or direct marketing purposes unless customers have explicitly…

Interesting. I feel like this clause is violated very often by major apps: > Push Notifications should not be used for promotions or direct marketing purposes unless customers have explicitly opted in to receive them via consent language displayed in your app’s UI, and you provide a method in your app for a user to opt out from receiving such messages.

I can hardly think of an app that uses notifications and doesn't abuse it that way. I pretty much block them as standard.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#497

Post by jay_kyburz »

ksec wrote: post #51

The problem isn't sending an Ad to Wallet. It is the fact that Apple openly attack Ads, condemns Ads, talk about privacy as fundamental human rights, and then have targeted Ads, in a place / software / services where no body expected it to appear. And not everybody has the Ad, so by HN / Reddit / Internet definition that Ad is targeted. The thing I used to like about Apple, even if you disagree with some of its decis…

Yeah, everybody is taking about the Wallet thing, but there is a giant ad for F1 in Apple TV right now that says it can only be watched in cinemas! WTF

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#498

Post by paulcole »

dijit wrote: post #442
TheBicPen wrote: post #430

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're seriously comparing a single advertisement to crimes like murder? Crimes that land you in prison are generally crimes that even children can understand are wrong. You're using "extremely poor decision" for 2 wildly different things, and if you think they're remotely equivalent, perhaps you should reflect on why you think that.

I am seriously suggesting that a single bad decision (like taking some money from the cash register) can land you in prison, why do we hold jobs to a higher standard? Learning from our mistakes is one thing, slip ups happen after all, but I’m just drawing a comparison to “a single misjudgement”. If you don't know societies values (stealing is wrong) or a companies values (tarnishing the brand by looking cheap and des…

> the outcome should probably be the same

Why exactly besides the fact that you like extreme solutions?

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#499

Post by Zafira »

keiferski wrote: post #40

Apple without Ive and Jobs increasingly has a taste problem. Everything from their ads to things like this are just in really poor taste, and aren’t something that they would have done 15 years ago because they would have thought it was beneath their brand. I like Apple, so I’m really hoping they bring on someone to solve this. Otherwise they’re on track to be the same as every other tasteless tech company. More on t…

I’m actually curious how they were able to exactly filter some of their less promising impulses.

Ive famously wanted the Apple Watch to be a standalone luxury product.

> Jony Ive envisioned the future of the Apple Watch as a luxury product. Not only did he want to build a $25 million lavish white tent to promote the first Watch, but he “regarded a rave from Vogue as more important than any tech reviewer’s opinion.” According to Mickle, “the tent was critical to making the event as glamorous as a high-end fashion show.”

Meanwhile Jobs always seemed to have an obsession with cubes (NeXTcube, Power Mac G4 Cube), no fans and nobody touching his products (the original iPhone “SDK” announcement was a badly received joke).

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#500

Post by mpalmer »

surgical_fire wrote: post #490
mpalmer wrote: post #482

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're not supposed to do anything. Why on earth would you discourage someone from finding joy in their work? It's possible.

> Why on earth would you discourage someone from finding joy in their work? For the same reason I discourage people believing in Santa Claus or in the Easter Bunny Finding joy in their work is a cute idea. But it is cute and false, believing in it will lead to nothing but frustration and lower income.

I'm sure believing that helps you if that's been your own experience. But it's demonstrably possible, at least for people for are not you.

Like, are you reading "find joy" as "find a job doing what you already love"? Those are different things.

This affectation of weary cynicism is so easy and popular. I'm over it.

Post reply on HN