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Stoop Coffee: A simple idea transformed my neighborhood

supernuclear.substack.com

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Re: Stoop Coffee: A simple idea transformed my neighborhood

#491

Post by dionidium »

lolinder wrote: post #488
dionidium wrote: post #487

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What you're describing is called "agreement." I'm very plainly arguing that if the distinction between "city" and "suburb" is to mean anything at all, then it can't just be about what's within municipal boundaries and what isn't.

So you were agreeing with OP's comment, not disagreeing? > Nobody I know would call that street the city. In my mind, "the city" is, minimally, houses that are a few feet apart, small yard in back/front, pretty much nothing on the side. Frequently, it's 2-3 story buildings, with whole floors rented out as an apartment. That's my "least dense" vision of a city. Anything less than that (ie, full yards) falls into my vi…

What this back-and-forth, and this thread more generally, demonstrates is that these words are not very useful.

They almost never clarify. What they do is produce silly arguments like this one.

Re: Stoop Coffee: A simple idea transformed my neighborhood

#492

Post by lolinder »

tptacek wrote: post #485
lolinder wrote: post #415

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I'm not, because I'm not saying that what you are identifying as a suburb isn't a suburb, I'm saying it's not representative of all suburbs. I provide a perfectly valid definition: > You're far enough the urban core that you probably have to drive to get to shops and jobs, but close enough to the urban core that you don't pass through farmland to get there. Since my definition is broader it's less susceptible to…

That is a definition you're making up to suit an argument you're making. It's not the actual definition of the term. Anybody can just look it up and see that! The Oxford Languages dataset that Google uses for the definition literally uses Chicago's suburbs as an example . And, seriously, who cares? Why would you want your argument to die on this hill? What could it possibly matter?

I'm not sure why you're critiquing my definition, given that I'm trying to emphasize that your specific Chicago suburb very much does meet the typical way that people think of suburbs. So yes, I agree with Google: Chicago's suburbs are suburbs. Oak Park is not within walking distance of anything that most people I know would identify as "the city", which puts it squarely in the suburbs in my book.

Did you read me as disagreeing with you, or did I misunderstand and you were trying to say that Oak Park isn't a suburb? Or is Oak Park actually within walking distance of "the city" as Chicagoans would identify it?

Re: Stoop Coffee: A simple idea transformed my neighborhood

#493

Post by littlekey »

geverett wrote: post #238

I'm the co-author of Supernuclear and editor of this post. We've been writing the blog for almost five years now, you never know what will go viral! I've spent my adult life living in Istanbul, New York, San Francisco, and San Juan, Puerto Rico. In Istanbul it sometimes felt like my neighbors knew too much about me - they would comment on who slept over (I had a lot of friends visit!) and once when I went out of town…

>isn't just about being able to borrow cup of sugar

this in particular is interesting to me because you used it to illustrate the minimum level of neighborly engagement, but I think many of us don't even reach that level. I for one would never think of asking my neighbor for cooking ingredients; in fact the idea of going over and knocking on their door for any purpose is almost inconceivable to me unless there was a medical emergency.

Not saying my mindset is right or even healthy, but that's how it is. There's a lot of work to be done.

Re: Stoop Coffee: A simple idea transformed my neighborhood

#494

Post by tptacek »

lolinder wrote: post #492
tptacek wrote: post #485

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is a definition you're making up to suit an argument you're making. It's not the actual definition of the term. Anybody can just look it up and see that! The Oxford Languages dataset that Google uses for the definition literally uses Chicago's suburbs as an example . And, seriously, who cares? Why would you want your argument to die on this hill? What could it possibly matter?

I'm not sure why you're critiquing my definition, given that I'm trying to emphasize that your specific Chicago suburb very much does meet the typical way that people think of suburbs. So yes, I agree with Google: Chicago's suburbs are suburbs. Oak Park is not within walking distance of anything that most people I know would identify as "the city", which puts it squarely in the suburbs in my book. Did you read me as…

Oh I may just be reading the thread backwards! Sorry. Yes, Oak Park is definitely a suburb. Oak Park is also extremely within walking distance of the city; it's across Austin Blvd from it.

Re: Stoop Coffee: A simple idea transformed my neighborhood

#495

Post by soulofmischief »

paulcole wrote: post #406
soulofmischief wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems unnecessarily harsh toward people who like to travel.

It’s harsh to be removed from a group chat around an event that you don’t attend monthly? What would be your personal threshold for non-harsh?

I'm saying that I would generally avoid such a paradigm if I'm trying to make real, lasting friends and build a strong local community, given that I might disappear or travel for a month at a time.

It's great if other people are finding enjoyment in such a process, but it doesn't fulfill my personal goals, and it does indeed come across as harsh and unwelcoming toward non-hyperlocal or family-oriented people.

Re: Stoop Coffee: A simple idea transformed my neighborhood

#496

Post by paulcole »

soulofmischief wrote: post #495
paulcole wrote: post #406

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s harsh to be removed from a group chat around an event that you don’t attend monthly? What would be your personal threshold for non-harsh?

I'm saying that I would generally avoid such a paradigm if I'm trying to make real, lasting friends and build a strong local community, given that I might disappear or travel for a month at a time. It's great if other people are finding enjoyment in such a process, but it doesn't fulfill my personal goals, and it does indeed come across as harsh and unwelcoming toward non-hyperlocal or family-oriented people.

What would be your personal threshold for non-harsh?

Re: Stoop Coffee: A simple idea transformed my neighborhood

#497

Post by AdieuToLogic »

kortilla wrote: post #372
AdieuToLogic wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The group is at a critical point now, having ~100 Whatsapp members. From what I've seen this creates a chilling effect where you inevitably end up with cliques and social cooling. The way to minimize this fear is by encouraging members to send welcoming messages to those new to the community. Celebrate the growth instead of fearing the unknown. > No new members will feel like they can actually send a message into a…

> Much like what I am doing here to what I assume is a group exceeding 100+ members. Under an anonymous account to people you don’t have to see in person.

>> Much like what I am doing here to what I assume is a group exceeding 100+ members.

> Under an anonymous account to people you don’t have to see in person.

Does this lessen the fear of being rebuked when sharing thoughts in a public forum one values?

Perhaps it would for people whom enjoy trolling. I do not and have no reason to think you do either.

So we are left to stand on what we post here, with no other connection, no other commonality, only to accept each other for the thoughts we exchange.

Re: Stoop Coffee: A simple idea transformed my neighborhood

#498

Post by lolinder »

dionidium wrote: post #491
lolinder wrote: post #488

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you were agreeing with OP's comment, not disagreeing? > Nobody I know would call that street the city. In my mind, "the city" is, minimally, houses that are a few feet apart, small yard in back/front, pretty much nothing on the side. Frequently, it's 2-3 story buildings, with whole floors rented out as an apartment. That's my "least dense" vision of a city. Anything less than that (ie, full yards) falls into my vi…

What this back-and-forth, and this thread more generally, demonstrates is that these words are not very useful. They almost never clarify. What they do is produce silly arguments like this one.

That's why people have been using paragraphs to clarify what they mean. Paragraphs that you seem to have ignored in favor of critiquing the utility that specific words have when taken out of the context the author intentionally put them in.

Re: Stoop Coffee: A simple idea transformed my neighborhood

#499

Post by huimang »

theyinwhy wrote: post #387

I know this is offtopic but why are people pushing Whats App? They could have used Signal just as well. Privacy literacy seems to be neglected so so much.

It's likely the path of least resistance. Many people have whatsapp and it's far preferable to sms. Significantly fewer people have heard of signal, let alone have it installed. And privacy literacy, for a neighbor group chat?

Re: Stoop Coffee: A simple idea transformed my neighborhood

#500

Post by archagon »

rahimnathwani wrote: post #261
archagon wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cool! I live close to Valencia/17th. Was just wondering if it was somewhere in my area: the houses looked Missiony but I couldn’t immediately place them.

I'm so envious! I love browsing the books at Community Thrift, but most days I don't have time to walk that far.

That shop is great! I've found a variety of treasures there over the last few years, including a mint-condition red leather recliner for $150 and a 60's era Soviet toy house. My favorite was a beautifully executed, life-sized oil painting of a nude; it started at $1200 and went down to $200 over the course of a few weeks, at which point I just had to buy it despite not really having the wall space to hang it up. I wanted to find out more about the subject, so I Googled the artist's signature, found the painting on his website, and reached out to chat. Turns out the painting had been stolen from his friend's house decades ago and he'd been looking for it ever since! We met up after he told me his story and I "sold" the painting back to him for the listing price; he left me a very generous tip and an art book. (See "The Platonic Friend" at https://www.kevinkearney.org/portfolio/figures.)
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