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US lawmakers tell Apple, Google to be ready to remove TikTok from stores Jan. 19

reuters.com

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Re: US lawmakers tell Apple, Google to be ready to remove TikTok from stores Jan. 19

#491

Post by snapcaster »

xanderlewis wrote: post #427
t0bia_s wrote: post #416

Earlier quoted context omitted.

- they're banning stupid, memes/brainrot app Imagine same rhetoric by CCP adressing Facebook or YouTube.

You can imagine it. But they'd be wrong. Facebook and YouTube aren't directly controlled by an enemy government, and likely aren't intending as part of their raison d'être to sow discord and chaos in China.

Then why did all these sites comply with government directives on covid 'misinformation' or gaza? if they say "how high?" when the government says jump who cares what the official on paper corporate structures are?

Re: US lawmakers tell Apple, Google to be ready to remove TikTok from stores Jan. 19

#492

Post by dkd903 »

brookst wrote: post #146
gkanai wrote: post #100

Reciprocity is key. Google and Facebook and most Western web services are blocked in China. If that is the case, then there should be no complaint with blocking Bytedance/other Chinese apps in the West.

So… if China mistreats their citizens, reciprocity says we must mistreat ours? You don’t fight censorship with censorship. That doesn’t stand up to even the most cursory thought. You fight censorship with openness. As soon as you find yourself arguing that you have no choice but to engage in the same behaviors you claim to dislike, you have literally become the enemy.

[dead]

Re: US lawmakers tell Apple, Google to be ready to remove TikTok from stores Jan. 19

#493

Post by shlant »

HKH2 wrote: post #445
tester756 wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Censorship... zzzZZZzz They're banning app/news delivery app managed by enemy government It is not like they're blocking internet, wikipedia they're banning stupid, memes/brainrot app

Chinese Tiktok is forcibly wholesome (by Chinese standards). They do not believe in absolute freedom of speech. Now Americans have just conceded that they don't believe in it either. It's good that we're all on the same page now.

why does nobody know what freedom of speech is anymore...

Re: US lawmakers tell Apple, Google to be ready to remove TikTok from stores Jan. 19

#494

Post by joe200 »

tw1984 wrote: post #471
professor_v wrote: post #468

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So how do we ensure that Tiktok doesn't covertly alter the algorithm to subtly include propaganda tailored to China's geopolitical interests that are detrimental to the US? Or even just propaganda tailored to enhance internal strife to weaken the country?

this is the exact same question being asked around the global - how could you be sure that American made LLMs are not altered in a way to maximize US interests at the costs of everyone else's.

You cannot. But in US you have elections every 4 years wheres in Russia or China both Putin and Xi are "elected" for their lifetime. Does it tell you anything ?

Re: US lawmakers tell Apple, Google to be ready to remove TikTok from stores Jan. 19

#495

Post by shlant »

Keyframe wrote: post #443
brookst wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So… if China mistreats their citizens, reciprocity says we must mistreat ours? You don’t fight censorship with censorship. That doesn’t stand up to even the most cursory thought. You fight censorship with openness. As soon as you find yourself arguing that you have no choice but to engage in the same behaviors you claim to dislike, you have literally become the enemy.

censorship schmensorship. This is more banal than that. China bans US companies from doing business in China. This is quid pro quo. Chinese companies, of the same industry, are getting banned in US.

> This is quid pro quo

do you mean "tit for tat" or something similar?

Re: US lawmakers tell Apple, Google to be ready to remove TikTok from stores Jan. 19

#496

Post by joe200 »

api wrote: post #482
flkenosad wrote: post #459

I really hate how people are arguing that it should be banned because of the content being inappropriate in one way or another when the content you see is based on how you interact with the app. We don't all see the same stuff. So yeah China may have more educational content but that's probably just becuase the people there are interested in that stuff. When I travel to the mountains, I get more outdoorsy/hiking vide…

This is really naive. These algorithms can be and are tuned to manipulate the audience. That being said, it’s not fair to single out TikTok. They all do it. The only unique danger with TikTok is that it could be controlled by a foreign adversary, or at least could be more easily than the others.

The danger with TikTok is that some already used it to influence elections (recently in Romania) so it is proven to be working.

Re: US lawmakers tell Apple, Google to be ready to remove TikTok from stores Jan. 19

#497

Post by tw1984 »

hiddencost wrote: post #127
supriyo-biswas wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Doesn't censor content" is probably not describing the situation correctly; while some companies like Google have typically resisted such in the aughts, they regularly take requests from other countries of this sort, and it'd be very simple for them to reenter the China market by having a stance similar to what they have for other countries. The issue here is probably caused by the requirement for an ICP recordal wh…

Google tried to, but failed due to employee revolt: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragonfly_(search_engine) Microsoft Bing has been merrily operating in China for a very long time: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2024-03-07/microsoft...

and it is the top1 desktop search engine in China, way ahead of baidu.com.

Re: US lawmakers tell Apple, Google to be ready to remove TikTok from stores Jan. 19

#498

Post by mattgreenrocks »

flkenosad wrote: post #452
tester756 wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Censorship... zzzZZZzz They're banning app/news delivery app managed by enemy government It is not like they're blocking internet, wikipedia they're banning stupid, memes/brainrot app

If your timeline is brainrot it's because the algorithm has determined that is what you like.

It goes beyond the algorithm. Have you seen the garbage that shows up in trending lists?

Re: US lawmakers tell Apple, Google to be ready to remove TikTok from stores Jan. 19

#499

Post by shlant »

rightbyte wrote: post #349
kelnos wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your argument is predicated on the idea that banning TikTok is censorship. It's not. No speech or information is being suppressed; any speech being made on TikTok can instead be made on other platforms. This isn't like China where the government bans any services they can't control, and directs the services that they can control to suppress any information they don't want people talking about.

> Your argument is predicated on the idea that banning TikTok is censorship. It's not. My take is that the elite was shocked the American youth is vaning in their Israel support and that they want algorithmic feeds that are sionist. Simple as that.

I really need to coin the phenomenon of when people attribute the reasoning for something happening as being due to the current thing they care about. I see it so often. Some sort of specific confirmation bias.

Re: US lawmakers tell Apple, Google to be ready to remove TikTok from stores Jan. 19

#500

Post by philipwhiuk »

tw1984 wrote: post #471
professor_v wrote: post #468

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So how do we ensure that Tiktok doesn't covertly alter the algorithm to subtly include propaganda tailored to China's geopolitical interests that are detrimental to the US? Or even just propaganda tailored to enhance internal strife to weaken the country?

this is the exact same question being asked around the global - how could you be sure that American made LLMs are not altered in a way to maximize US interests at the costs of everyone else's.

And they'll have the same choice to make. That they can make this choice shouldn't alter whether the US makes the choice on it's own merits.
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