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EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

appleinsider.com

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Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#491

Post by justapassenger »

HWR_14 wrote: post #330
faeriechangling wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never installed the Meta omni-permission store on my Android, but I've certainly installed Facebook's applications via the Play Store. I'm not sure why the situation would be any different with iOS. It seems to me that the app store would still utterly dominate even if it were exposed to competition.

Google's Play Store allows Meta apps more permissions than Apple's App Store currently does. Meta lost tens of billions in market value (and an estimated $10 billion a year in revenue) when the new Apple App Store privacy rules went into effect. That's a powerful incentive.

And just by pure coincidence, Apple started to push much more of their ads in their App Store around that time.

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#492

Post by Keyframe »

highwayman47 wrote: post #406
nunez wrote: post #166

Fucking good. It's bullshit that you can only run Safari on iOS or that the App Store is the only store you can use. Yes, I understand the security implications of a third-party browser having deeper integrations into the OS and potential battery life concerns. I also don't care. I want to run Firefox on my phone. The actual thing. With containers and extensions. Let Safari compete on the merits. I want the choice of…

[flagged]

That's just straight up drinking from the Apple Kool-Aid PR fountain.

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#493

Post by Keyframe »

faeriechangling wrote: post #227
nunez wrote: post #166

Fucking good. It's bullshit that you can only run Safari on iOS or that the App Store is the only store you can use. Yes, I understand the security implications of a third-party browser having deeper integrations into the OS and potential battery life concerns. I also don't care. I want to run Firefox on my phone. The actual thing. With containers and extensions. Let Safari compete on the merits. I want the choice of…

>you can only run Safari on iOS Apple mandating WebKit is the only thing holding v8 back from a total monopoly, while WebKit itself has no chance of being a monopoly in the forseeable future, so I doubt there's a good anti-competitive case to be made for forcing Apple to stop doing this. It would only accelerate the monopolisation of the browser market if this happened. It would be good for consumers in the short ter…

You're advocating against v8 monopoly, where no one is forcing it down on anyone, by holding a candle to the actual enforced monopoly of WebKit? Where's consumer choice in this and how about having an actual choice dictate what is used and what isn't?

Let me quote from a familiar case: "Antitrust laws ensure one company doesn't control the market, deplete consumer choice, and inflate prices. Microsoft was accused of trying to create a monopoly that led to the collapse of rival Netscape by giving its browser software for free."

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#494

Post by pixl97 »

jahav wrote: post #483
Aeolun wrote: post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have the freedom to choose between Google or Apple. That’s not very free at all.

Huawei and HarmonyOS? I know, rather unpopular ouside of China.

Not even sure they're allowed to be imported into the US.

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#495

Post by wkat4242 »

jwells89 wrote: post #340
faeriechangling wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never installed the Meta omni-permission store on my Android, but I've certainly installed Facebook's applications via the Play Store. I'm not sure why the situation would be any different with iOS. It seems to me that the app store would still utterly dominate even if it were exposed to competition.

The incentive for Meta, etc to start their own “anything goes” app stores was low when it was a possibility only on Android. It being possible on iOS changes the equation significantly with how iOS users are typically higher value targets due to how on average, they buy/spend more. It also gives them the opportunity to normalize per-megacorp app stores across the board instead of them always being a weird Android thi…

I'm sure it'll be a weird iOS thing too if it happens. Apple is going to make it as difficult as they possibly can, the same way sideloading is not trivial on Android for normal users.

Also running a third party store does not have to mean being able to break privacy protections. If the ecosystem relies on app inspections that much it simply needs to be secured better.

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#496

Post by wkat4242 »

xdennis wrote: post #371
faeriechangling wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>you can only run Safari on iOS Apple mandating WebKit is the only thing holding v8 back from a total monopoly, while WebKit itself has no chance of being a monopoly in the forseeable future, so I doubt there's a good anti-competitive case to be made for forcing Apple to stop doing this. It would only accelerate the monopolisation of the browser market if this happened. It would be good for consumers in the short ter…

> Apple mandating WebKit is the only thing holding v8 back from a total monopoly No, V8 has almost total monopoly because countries are ignoring anti-competitive practices. The EU is doing something about Apple in this case, and it should look at Google too.

It does look at Google too. Google is constantly being fined for transgressions and they are also a gatekeeper under this law just as Apple is.

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#497

Post by wkat4242 »

jahav wrote: post #483
Aeolun wrote: post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have the freedom to choose between Google or Apple. That’s not very free at all.

Huawei and HarmonyOS? I know, rather unpopular ouside of China.

That's simply rebranded Android.

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#498

Post by wkat4242 »

kajumix wrote: post #252
grishka wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not about personal choices, it's about enabling fair competition. If you sell a general-purpose computing device and market it as one, you should relinquish any control of it once it's sold.

Competition is the natural state of affairs. Nobody has to enable it. IBM/Microsoft weren't forced by the EU to give up market dominance in PCs. And if the EU tried, it couldn't ever do a better job than Apple did. It's no surprise that EU lags so much behind the US in tech innovation.

This is a big difference in viewpoint between the US and EU. The US has an undying belief in free market forces. Yet its government is beholden to those same big money forces through campaign contributions. Leading to a peculiar corporate oligarchy (really how democratic is it if you need millions in donations with strings attached to have a chance to win?). We in the EU want to avoid this and keep government serving the interests of citizens.

The EU tries to balance this out with more regulation to prevent the stalemate and conflict of interests that exists in the US. Things like the Senate launch system that just exists for pork. Our welfare is for citizens, not big business :)

And it's fine, Apple doesn't have to enable sideloading in the US. But if they want to sell here they'll have to play by our rules.

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#499

Post by [deleted] »

martimarkov wrote: post #353
LeoNatan25 wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All of that is already accounted for and protected by in the OS. An app cannot normally register daemons or agent (or even an XPC service). Installing is already limited to FrontBoard standard installation mechanism. All that will remain in a possible open iOS future.

Except usage of private APIs?

[deleted]

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#500

Post by bitwize »

One thing that Nintendo learned in the 80s is if you want to sell a platform with a sustainable perception of quality, you take responsibility for ensuring that garbage doesn't run on that platform. That means restrictions. Opening everything up on iOS/iPadOS will severely compromise Apple's ability to maintain its value-add in the marketplace as the best quality, most end-user-friendly mobile platform, as well as their security posture.
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