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Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

annehelen.substack.com

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Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#491

Post by selimthegrim »

dstaley wrote: post #362
simfree wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depending on the car and where you live insurance can be lower or higher. Outside of collector/classic car insurance policies (eg: this is not a daily driver car and you agree not to exceed a low number of miles yearly) or parked insurance (a few hundred miles a year), there is not $200 to $300 a year car insurance in the USA. Tribal reservations don't require license plates or insurance usually, and you cab choose t…

> Outside of collector/classic car insurance policies or parked insurance, there is not $200 to $300 a year car insurance in the USA. Absolutely beg to differ. I was on a high-deductible, low-benefit plan for a two-year old used economy car in Louisiana with no marks on my driving record for $250/month. The insurance cost was more than the monthly cost of the car. That being said, it was more than the state mandated…

Louisiana is high because of the plaintiff friendly courts where even minor accidents are litigated, the trial lawyers making money off of it, and the traffic courts which bargain down speeding tickets to brake tag violations all the time (which is priced in by the insurance companies)

Source: I live in New Orleans.

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#492

Post by fallingknife »

ericbarrett wrote: post #255
jschveibinz wrote: post #2

This article unfortunately doesn't address the business side of the problem. Fast food restaurants, or place like "Dale's" mentioned in the article, make very little profit. It is most likely below 10%. Here is an estimate: https://www.restaurant365.com/blog/what-is-the-average-profi... . A 10% profit is very modest. That's not the story of the "fat cats getting rich on the back of the workers" that the article is al…

What about franchise fees? Independent fast food restaurants basically don’t exist in the U.S. anymore. An individual McDonalds may be scraping the boundary of profitability, but corporate had a net income of $1.5B last quarter[0], or about $7,500 per employee per quarter [1]. That’s net income, not revenue. [0] https://corporate.mcdonalds.com/content/dam/gwscorp/assets/i... [1] https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/cha…

I feel like there's never been more independent (or local chain) burger joints, food trucks, and just fast food in general.

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#493

Post by pessimizer »

zizee wrote: post #382

Honest question: why do discussions about minimum wage in the U.S. never propose having teenagers having a different minimum to adults? In australia we have a $12.50/hr minimum for 15 year olds. It climbs in increments until about $25/hr. This system allows teenagers to get a foot in the door for low-skilled jobs, and allows adults to get paid a livable wage. The result is that a lot of fast food jobs are performed b…

You don't want to create a class of people who get paid badly because their jobs are terrible (and also low-skilled.) The only reason you would want a lower minimum wage for young people is because young people are stupid, and you want to put them into a job where they can learn i.e. low-skilled, but ramping up over time, like an apprenticeship. Paying people almost nothing to work a horrible job because you can get away with it is just creating a slave class, and the primary beneficiaries are the companies that employ them.

The gap between a juvenile minimum wage and an adult minimum wage should equal the value of the on-the-job training that the juvenile is getting. And there's really no reason to tie that to youth, although demographically it will be dominated by young people; adults might accept a lower minimum wage in exchange for education in the trade.

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#494

Post by heavyset_go »

toast0 wrote: post #182
rossdavidh wrote: post #43

Well, there's a straightforward (I don't say easy) way to fix this: you require a high enough minimum wage (and healthcare, and sick leave, and etc.). It's not like the restaurant owner has the option of just deciding to pay twice or three times the labor costs, and trust that their customers will be happy to cover the difference, if their competitors don't have to do the same. Because, those restaurant (and retail a…

Tying healthcare insurance to employment isn't really the direction we want to be going. When the individual market was terrible, it made sense to push employers to buy it for their workers, because you got better coverage for less money that way. Now the state marketplaces are at least mediocre; coverage and costs are similar to what you might get as a small or mid sized employer. We should be pushing people towards…

> Now the state marketplaces are at least mediocre; coverage and costs are similar to what you might get as a small or mid sized employer. We should be pushing people towards marketplace plans, and not trying to continue the employer plan model.

I've priced out what a similar plan that I got from an employer would be when I went first bought insurance on the individual market. They are not even comparable.

For example, a similar family plan on the individual market would cost over $30k in premiums, with an $8k deductible and a $17k out of pocket maximum each year with co-pays.

For a similar plan for myself, I'm looking at nearly $10k in premiums, $3k deductible, and an $8k yearly out of pocket maximum, along with co-pays etc.

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#495

Post by magila »

gilbetron wrote: post #359
nickff wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your second sentence is debatable, as it appears that many European countries have high enough minimum total compensations (including benefits and other indirect costs) that unemployment is relatively high, and it can be very tough to get on the economic ladder.

Which countries are suffering from this?

France and Italy have long had chronically high unemployment, particularly among young adults who struggle to gain entry into the workforce due to the high cost floor on labor.

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#496

Post by tastyfreeze »

ramshorns wrote: post #448
zizee wrote: post #382

Honest question: why do discussions about minimum wage in the U.S. never propose having teenagers having a different minimum to adults? In australia we have a $12.50/hr minimum for 15 year olds. It climbs in increments until about $25/hr. This system allows teenagers to get a foot in the door for low-skilled jobs, and allows adults to get paid a livable wage. The result is that a lot of fast food jobs are performed b…

Paying poverty wages is wrong, and child labour is wrong. They don't cancel each other out.

Exploitive child labor is wrong. Allowing teens to willingly enter an employmemt contract is neither exploitive nor child labor.

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#497

Post by humanrebar »

dragonwriter wrote: post #488
humanrebar wrote: post #481

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. Anyone who says "teenagers shouldn't have jobs" comes from a place of privilege.

No, someone who says “teenagers don’t need jobs in the status quo” comes from a place of privilege. Someone can recognize the status quo and yet believe that the needs it creates ought to be changed. There was a time younger children needed jobs to. The reason they did was largely because the fact that they could be employed drove down wages for adult workers. One who said children didn’t need jobs at that time would…

Well, maybe where we disagree is that I see being employed by someone you're not related to as being a valuable life experience appropriate for a teenager, especially if you have loved ones around to teach you how to get, keep, and (if need be) leave a job.

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#498

Post by conanbatt »

dmitriid wrote: post #350
fighterpilot wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That assumes no substitutes, but in reality this will increase the relative cost of restaurants compared to home cooking which will reduce demand for take out.

Ah yeah. You can always look at how Europe is empty and has very few, if any, restaurants with their minimum wages and healthcare. Oh wait...

Or unemployment..oh wait...

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#499

Post by tryonenow »

pessimizer wrote: post #493
zizee wrote: post #382

Honest question: why do discussions about minimum wage in the U.S. never propose having teenagers having a different minimum to adults? In australia we have a $12.50/hr minimum for 15 year olds. It climbs in increments until about $25/hr. This system allows teenagers to get a foot in the door for low-skilled jobs, and allows adults to get paid a livable wage. The result is that a lot of fast food jobs are performed b…

You don't want to create a class of people who get paid badly because their jobs are terrible (and also low-skilled.) The only reason you would want a lower minimum wage for young people is because young people are stupid, and you want to put them into a job where they can learn i.e. low-skilled, but ramping up over time, like an apprenticeship. Paying people almost nothing to work a horrible job because you can get…

You're not going to create a slave class by paying teenagers a lower minimum wage for a couple years.

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#500

Post by humanrebar »

adgjlsfhk1 wrote: post #470
humanrebar wrote: post #383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have a good point, and I appreciate the evenhanded approach. I'm still far from sold that "poverty wage" is a useful term if we want to have a healthy discussion. It leaves too much nuance out.

Name one state where someone making minimum wage can afford an apartment, food, healthcare, and utilities, and some form of transportation. I think it's fair to say that if you can't, that counts as poverty.

Who says that's the point of minimum wage? That's where we disagree.
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