What went wrong with the Texas power grid? • Hacker News Board

Re: What went wrong with the Texas power grid?

#491

Post by woeirua » Wed, Feb 17, 2021, 2:25 AM UTC

cavisne wrote: post #463

bbreier wrote: post #447

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you might have missed this important line: > Most of the power knocked offline came from thermal sources, Woodfin said, particularly natural gas.

backup generation (gas) is not working. As mentioned. When your only on-demand source of generation is only profitable in peak periods its a recipe for disaster.

Again, this is not what is actually happening. Texas has heaps of on demand natural gas generators. They froze up with the storm and failed to turn on. Has nothing to do with renewable.

Re: What went wrong with the Texas power grid?

#492

Post by koolba » Wed, Feb 17, 2021, 2:26 AM UTC

mrfusion wrote: post #294

tw04 wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I don't think any lost heat (most have gas) but at least one person found their gas fireplace they were hoping would heat them up when out of power didn't really work that well. I'm curious how they didn't lose heat. Any furnace built in the last 30 years, even gas, has an electronic control board in order to ensure it doesn't accidentally turn on the gas without a functioning pilot light and/or heating element (whi…

My gas fireplace had a place you could put in D batteries to run it. Pretty cool feature if the power goes out.

Having grown up with wood fireplaces, the thought of having to change the batteries to turn it on is hilarious.

Re: What went wrong with the Texas power grid?

#493

Post by ziftface » Wed, Feb 17, 2021, 2:27 AM UTC

justinzollars wrote: post #436

Jcampuzano2 wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Houston right now, haven't had power, nor water since yesterday. My room is sitting at 20ish degrees and has been all day. I've quite literally been snug under a load of blankets with my wife all day just to stay warm. My office back in Dallas which is not normally open offered to let people stay the night since they happen to be on the same grid as a hospital and I seriously considered trying to make it there today

dude, go to the office. Its too cold to sleep in those conditions.

I've found that it's much easier to sleep in this temperature than the rest of the day. You just bundle up under several blankets and it doesn't feel that different. Living in a 30 degree house does take some getting used to though.

Re: What went wrong with the Texas power grid?

#494

Post by zamadatix » Wed, Feb 17, 2021, 2:27 AM UTC

tyingq wrote: post #91

It was posted as it's own story here, but it's mildly fascinating to watch the demand versus supply figures from Ercot. And the demand, I assume, doesn't include those places currently without power. http://www.ercot.com/content/cdr/html/real_time_system_condi... As I post this, demand is 99+% of supply, and the outside temps are dropping.

I read ERCOT predicted "real" demand was estimated to be at least 75 MW at one point Monday. I imagine it's not much better with everyone needing to reheat their entire homes now either.

Re: What went wrong with the Texas power grid?

#495

Post by ghaff » Wed, Feb 17, 2021, 2:28 AM UTC

Animats wrote: post #484

qbasic_forever wrote: post #454

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good luck, and here's some advice from a midwesterner that has dealt with cold, ice, and snow forever. If it's cold enough to start freezing things inside then make sure you have some water flowing in your pipes. Keep your kitchen sink running on a low (very tiny) dribble. Maybe even keep a shower/bathrub running at a very low rate too. You do NOT want to be dealing with frozen, broken flooding pipes on top of no pow…

That's not recommended for some areas of Texas. There's low water pressure and water has to be conserved.[1] (Edit: Houston only.) [1] https://www.wfaa.com/article/weather/if-dripping-faucets-sav...

Be that as it may. Frozen pipes can be catastrophic.

Re: What went wrong with the Texas power grid?

#496

Post by jostmey » Wed, Feb 17, 2021, 2:28 AM UTC

I would say the situation is getting bad. Many of my colleagues don't have heat. Water pipes are bursting everywhere. I never imagined this would happen in Texas, which from my observations was well run compared to other places I've lived

Re: What went wrong with the Texas power grid?

#497

Post by Ensorceled » Wed, Feb 17, 2021, 2:29 AM UTC

lurquer wrote: post #334

Me1000 wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Climate change _is_ a result of global warming. It's not that complicated, so let me try and explain: climate patterns will change as the earth warms up. Jet streams change, hurricanes get more powerful and occur more frequently, etc. As for "no big deal", I don't know what else to say other than 15 people have already died. When it's below freezing and people are without heat, they will freeze to death. Not to menti…

>Climate change _is_ a result of global warming. You mean the cold weather is a result of global warming. Yeah. Whatever. As far as the rest of your comment, the warmth of your virtue and sensitivty has raised my room's temperature by a degree and I thank you. I am tearing up as I write this; your comment struck me to the core. Oh, the children... the poor freezing people on covid-ventilators... the 15 who have -- so…

Can you not do ... whatever this is. It's not contributing.

Re: What went wrong with the Texas power grid?

#498

Post by jasondigitized » Wed, Feb 17, 2021, 2:29 AM UTC

lurquer wrote: post #273

com2kid wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If your house is 25f, put on a couple sweaters and a coat and have a beer. It’s not the end of the world. Houses were designed very differently 150 years ago. Lower roofs, fewer windows, huge thick drapes or tapestries on the walls, animal skins or carpets on the floors. 9 ft windows (double pane or not) on all walls is going to leak out a lot of heat. Most importantly, fireplaces. Houses had fireplaces, and rooms…

You clearly haven't been in many 150 year old West Texas houses. Good lord... The spread of AC in the 1930s resulted in everything in Texas being insulated out the wazoo. Your typical suburban home in Texas -- with no electricity -- is perfectly habitable without power. Its an inconvenience, to be sure. But, all this handwringing over a freak -- and fun -- event is laughable. Want to fret? Fret about floods, tornadoe…

Fun event? Bruh sit this one out.

Re: What went wrong with the Texas power grid?

#499

Post by cromwellian » Wed, Feb 17, 2021, 2:30 AM UTC

cavisne wrote: post #482

cromwellian wrote: post #455

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, but no. A 2011 FERC report cited problems in Texas gas/coal/nuke plants for failing to weatherize. They didn't fix the problems, and gas and sensing lines froze, taking gas/coal plants offline too. 2/3rds of the power that went offline from the storm was fossil. Moreover, Texas's independent grid (not connected to the rest of the US) makes it difficult for them to import power from neighboring states. Stop try…

The heavy reliance on natural gas is not traditional. Its a side effect of 1)

No, it's because natural gas got cheaper, and they switched to the cheaper source.

"The report also addresses the interdependency of the electric and natural gas industries. “Utilities are becoming increasingly reliant on gas-fired generation, in large part because shale production has dramatically reduced the cost of gas,”

In 2011 when this happened before, Texas had even less renewables. I realize you're trying to hard to sell an ideology to blame renewables for what is really, gross mismanagement of the Texas grid, including fossil and nuclear power, but the reality is much more complex than your simple narrative.

https://twitter.com/i/events/1361767999200317440

Re: What went wrong with the Texas power grid?

#500

Post by O5vYtytb » Wed, Feb 17, 2021, 2:30 AM UTC

aardvarkr wrote: post #145

txlpo78 wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This current problems wouldn’t be fixed if Texas wasn’t on its own grid. The Texas grid does have connections to the other grids, and even right now is importing power from both the East and West interconnections. The problem is that this is a truly regional event and not just isolated to Texas. The entire central US is struggling right now. The SPP (which manages electricity for Oklahoma, Nebraska, Arkansas, and oth…

FYI the Texas grid runs on a different frequency than the other two grids and as a result incurs MASSIVE efficiency penalties for that hubris. If I recall correctly it has to be converted from AC to DC then back to Texas’ AC.

Technically they run on at different phase, but the same frequency (60hz)