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Eat less meat: UN climate change report calls for change to human diet

nature.com

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Re: Eat less meat: UN climate change report calls for change to human diet

#491

Post by andy_ppp »

the_gastropod wrote: post #464
andy_ppp wrote: post #458

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nhzV-J1h0do I suppose you’ll disagree with his analysis because the FDA say eat loads of carbs.

Or because Nattia is a hack with close ties with the animal agricultural industry: https://www.politico.com/story/2015/10/the-money-behind-the-...

From the article: "Taubes and Attia advocate a low-carb diet much like Teicholz; however, they have hired researchers who disagree with them to conduct groundbreaking nutrition studies."

They sound like right hacks. I'm not sure if you think the sugar industry paying for studies is great either, which a lot were.

Re: Eat less meat: UN climate change report calls for change to human diet

#492

Post by magduf »

ashelmire wrote: post #358
mark_l_watson wrote: post #236

At least in the USA, this could in principle be fixed by ending the corporate welfare state. Old news, but All major industries like the beef industry get huge tax breaks, free water and other giveaways at the general taxpayer’s expense. Fixing the corruption (both democratic and republican parties) in our our political would end up helping the environment a lot. That said, we have zero chance of fixing our corrupt p…

> I have mixed feelings about Beyond Meat: my wife and I love the hot Italian sausage and burgers, but it is really not that healthy. Regular veggie burgers and other products (not trying to imitate meat) are usually really good. They should embrace the fact that they can include a vast array of vegetables and spices. Example: Morningstar farms has a chickpea burger I really like. Also it's much cheaper than Beyond p…

>We should teach people to cook healthy vegan food that they enjoy.

That just isn't realistic; you'll wind up with a lot of really unhealthy people eating food they hate. Not everyone is good at cooking, and one big reason veganism is so unpopular is because it's so hard to make anything that tastes good with it. Meat is easy to cook, even for people who aren't very good at cooking. And veganism is generally unhealthy, because most people aren't dedicated or good enough at it to get the proper nutrition, so they leave out critical nutrients, whereas with meat it's really easy to get everything you need (like iron).

Expecting the whole populace to get good at cooking vegan food is like expecting the whole populace to become very skilled at C++ programming (including template metaprogramming). It isn't going to happen.

If someone makes vegan pre-made meals that can just be microwaved, that would be different.

Re: Eat less meat: UN climate change report calls for change to human diet

#493

Post by henryaj »

therealdrag0 wrote: post #400
Will_Parker wrote: post #363

From https://skepticalscience.com/animal-agriculture-meat-global-... "Animal agriculture is responsible for 13–18% of human-caused greenhouse gas emissions globally, and less in developed countries (e.g. 3% in the USA). Fossil fuel combustion for energy and transportation is responsible for approximately 64% of human-caused greenhouse gas emissions globally, and more in developed countries (e.g. 80% in the USA)." I t…

Woah. I always thought it was more than that. EPA puts it at only 9% https://www.epa.gov/ghgemissions/inventory-us-greenhouse-gas...

It's more than that because of land use changes caused by animal agriculture: https://twitter.com/GeorgeMonbiot/status/1159831081798864898...

Re: Eat less meat: UN climate change report calls for change to human diet

#494

Post by henryaj »

dsirola wrote: post #479

The report states with high confidence that balanced diets featuring plant-based, and sustainably-produced animal-sourced, food “present major opportunities for adaptation and mitigation while generating significant co-benefits in terms of human health”. I think this says it all. The consumption is not as much of a problem as production. They don't mention how much forest is also cut to build farms and it's not like…

> it's not like plant growing industry is any better in terms of emissions

Animal agriculture is enormously more resource-intensive than plant agriculture:

https://twitter.com/GeorgeMonbiot/status/1159831081798864898...

How are we still having this debate?

Re: Eat less meat: UN climate change report calls for change to human diet

#495

Post by [deleted] »

Will_Parker wrote: post #363

From https://skepticalscience.com/animal-agriculture-meat-global-... "Animal agriculture is responsible for 13–18% of human-caused greenhouse gas emissions globally, and less in developed countries (e.g. 3% in the USA). Fossil fuel combustion for energy and transportation is responsible for approximately 64% of human-caused greenhouse gas emissions globally, and more in developed countries (e.g. 80% in the USA)." I t…

[deleted]

Re: Eat less meat: UN climate change report calls for change to human diet

#496

Post by magduf »

hanniabu wrote: post #379
mark_l_watson wrote: post #236

At least in the USA, this could in principle be fixed by ending the corporate welfare state. Old news, but All major industries like the beef industry get huge tax breaks, free water and other giveaways at the general taxpayer’s expense. Fixing the corruption (both democratic and republican parties) in our our political would end up helping the environment a lot. That said, we have zero chance of fixing our corrupt p…

> At least in the USA, this could in principle be fixed by ending the corporate welfare state. Old news, but All major industries like the beef industry get huge tax breaks, free water and other giveaways at the general taxpayer’s expense. Unfortunately, in my experience when I bring this up the typical response us that I must be a socialist.

In America, saying anything unAmerican is "socialist". So advocating things like much stricter gun laws, more public transit, or ending tax breaks and other giveaways to large politically-connected corporations are unAmerican and therefore "socialist" in American parlance.

Re: Eat less meat: UN climate change report calls for change to human diet

#497

Post by wtdata »

mklarmann wrote: post #480
ailideex wrote: post #361

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't really argue with that, which is why people don't and just downvote.

Na, I think it is downvoted because it is pretty neo-liberal, to assume that population control is the solution, because it implicitly neglects that most emissions are caused by the richest people. Reducing those rich people would well be a fair point, though.

Your point logically implies that you are against increasing life conditions of the people that are born poor in those countries with high birth rates.

Re: Eat less meat: UN climate change report calls for change to human diet

#498

Post by Retric »

shlant wrote: post #434
Retric wrote: post #398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Men on a 2,000 calorie diet are recommended a minimum of 56 grams of protein. 0.8 per kg is for a generic sedentary lifestyle, with increased activity your needs go up. 2000 calories on a 62.5 kg person is a non sedentary lifestyle.

Is there a name for a general protein deficiency?

Generally it's grouped under malnutrition though the severe from is Kwashiorkor. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protein%E2%80%93energy_malnutr... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kwashiorkor

Moderate levels generally shows up as low albumin levels on a blood test aka Hypoalbuminemia a type of Hypoproteinemia, and is associated with a huge range of symptoms. Westerners generally only get this due to Malabsorption.

Re: Eat less meat: UN climate change report calls for change to human diet

#499

Post by alisonatwork »

Freak_NL wrote: post #460
ictebres wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, living in Berlin I feel spoiled. When I was in South Korea, most of the time there was nothing vegetarian on the menu, in Berlin you have multiple vegan options and even more vegetarian options. I believe restaurant options are very important since people learn from those and mimic them at home. We need restaurants to offer more vegetarian and vegan dishes for people to see that they can have a rich (IMHO richer…

> I don’t know how to nudge the restaurants though Visit and ask for vegetarian or vegan dishes. Move on if there is nothing worthwhile; let the staff know if you've liked a particular dish or find the selection too limiting. Demand drives supply. In the Netherlands the vegetarian option used to be a boring salad with goat cheese. Nowadays not having decent meat-free options means you can't compete with the rest. Thi…

Years ago i remember someone making a joke that the best way to promote veganism was to only buy vegan products at Aldi. The point was to avoid this kind of bourgeois trickle down veganism.

It was interesting to me leaving Europe and coming to China. In upper class restaurants here, they put meat in everything, even as a "seasoning" in veg dishes. I think it's seen as an indicator of wealth. At working class restaurants the cheapest dishes are all veg, or have only the barest scraping of ground pork or bone stock. I much prefer to eat out here than i did in Europe (and definitely the North America) where meat and dairy tends to be the default option for blue collar grub. I still don't really understand how that works, economically.

Re: Eat less meat: UN climate change report calls for change to human diet

#500

Post by taffer »

Will_Parker wrote: post #363

From https://skepticalscience.com/animal-agriculture-meat-global-... "Animal agriculture is responsible for 13–18% of human-caused greenhouse gas emissions globally, and less in developed countries (e.g. 3% in the USA). Fossil fuel combustion for energy and transportation is responsible for approximately 64% of human-caused greenhouse gas emissions globally, and more in developed countries (e.g. 80% in the USA)." I t…

That 3% figure prbably doesn't take the global supply chain, deforestation and consumption shift towards western diets in developping and emerging economies into account.

At least in the UK Department of Energy and Climate Change's Global Calculator[1], the food lever seems to be much more powerful than your comment suggests.

[1] http://tool.globalcalculator.org

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