Well, there are only three Github founders, and a quick search seems to indicate that Tom Preston-Werner is the only one with a wife, Theresa: http://techcrunch.com/2013/11/27/omakase-charity-tech-indust...
This isn't important.
Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit
481–490 of 1001 posts
Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit
#482Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think it's really a huge stretch to go from oogling of hula hoopers to "feeling unsafe". What, after watching some women do hoola hoop men suddenly turn into rapists? That's 100% in her head and sounds slightly crazy to me, to be honest. Not even going to strip clubs turns men into rapists on a regular basis... I think that accusation is completely unwarranted (from the sounds of it).
After reading the article, it became pretty clear to me that whatever manner of "culture" github appears to be permeating internally, she was very far from it. This indicates she was a bad hire from the get-go. Hiring isn't just about talent, it's also about cultural fit, and while it's difficult to know with precision who fits a cultural dynamic, 1) such an issue is bound to arise as a company grows and 2) there had…
Apparently they were as excited to have her onboard as with any other new hire at the time: https://github.com/blog/1082-julie-ann-horvath-is-a-githubbe...
Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit
#483There seems to be several problems. Not entirely sexism. 1. Founder's wife asked Horvath out and gave her a lecture about who is the boss. Probably out of jealousy. 2. Founder's wife physically inanimate Horvath, making her unwelcome and scared. 3. Founder did not stop the wife and protect his wife. 4. Horvath was approached by a male co-worker and according to her her rejection had caused tension between her and tha…
To clarify for many of you, you don't need someone shouting "I HATE WOMEN" for sexism to be occurring. The sexism in this scenario is subtle and persistent, something that likely tainted all of the workplace interactions at github, allowing a female employee's problems at work to be continually ignored. This eventually built up to the issue most people are focusing on, a founders spouse being allowed to harass an emp…
> The hula hooping moment was important because it visibly demonstrated her male coworkers lack of respect for women as people. They were unabashedly staring at their female coworkers as "eyecandy" in that moment and even defended their doing so.
Totally disagree. If someone is hula hooping in a company that usually builds software to host version control repositories, they are doing something quite out of the ordinary, which is going to lead people to gawk. This does not necessarily imply sexual objectification, though it doesn't preclude it.
> They were unabashedly staring at their female coworkers as "eyecandy" in that moment and even defended their doing so.
Why should someone be "abashed" at staring at someone who is hula hooping in the office? This is slowly starting to lean towards 'thoughtcrime', as long as they don't make overtly sexual or lewd comments, they shouldn't be unnecessarily be accused of a "lack of respect for women as people".
Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit
#484There seems to be several problems. Not entirely sexism. 1. Founder's wife asked Horvath out and gave her a lecture about who is the boss. Probably out of jealousy. 2. Founder's wife physically inanimate Horvath, making her unwelcome and scared. 3. Founder did not stop the wife and protect his wife. 4. Horvath was approached by a male co-worker and according to her her rejection had caused tension between her and tha…
To clarify for many of you, you don't need someone shouting "I HATE WOMEN" for sexism to be occurring. The sexism in this scenario is subtle and persistent, something that likely tainted all of the workplace interactions at github, allowing a female employee's problems at work to be continually ignored. This eventually built up to the issue most people are focusing on, a founders spouse being allowed to harass an emp…
The sexism in this scenario is subtle and persistent, something that likely tainted all of the workplace interactions at github, allowing a female employee's problems at work to be continually ignored.
Lots of people of both sexes are impotent and disaffected at work, so it's not necessarily proof of anything when someone says "my opinion is not respected" and then finds superficials to explain it. If you can demonstrate a pattern, sure, but simply drawing from personal experience is very close to useless. In this case she is drawing from personal experience.
The hula hooping moment was important because it visibly demonstrated her male coworkers lack of respect for women as people.
What a gigantic jump. I mean, solar system crossing. Two people put on what sounds like a unique, if not artistic demonstration. People watch. It might actually be her own insecurities and hangups that led her to decry this, which is actually a perverse and rather incredible bit of sexism in itself ("women of Github...hide your shame. Don yon burkas and shroud yourself from the lusts of men").
This is not a clear story at all (clearly the founder's wife -- who is a significant owner of the company, fwiw -- got involved for something completely unspoken), and there is no reason for anyone to knee jerk to either side.
Further (and this comment is more general) it is toxic and repressive for the classic "Oh woe am I, look at all of the victim blaming in here! How offensive!". Github, and all of the players involved, are people too. Because one person yells the loudest and earliest doesn't mean that you can grab your torches with legitimacy without being the problem yourself.
Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit
#485Earlier quoted context omitted.
> The hula hooping moment was important because it visibly demonstrated her male coworkers lack of respect for women as people. They were unabashedly staring at their female coworkers as "eyecandy" in that moment and even defended their doing so. I have never understood how this argument works, obviously I'm missing something. Because I momentarily focus my attention on someone for their physical attributes, I automa…
You are not alone. I blame PC, overprotective upbringing and "I am offended by that" trend. As soon as some subject becomes taboo to discuss people lose the understanding why something is bad and start to treat everything related as bad and unacceptable. Reminds me of this: http://i.snag.gy/kdu77.jpg (doesn't matter if experiment was real or not). This is very prominent with sexism and racism—these words are losing t…
>Imagine that black person says: "I am proud to be black!".
>Now imagine that the white person says "I am proud to be white".
>Now throw away you knee-jercky reaction and think about it.
I thought about it, and here's what I found: The different reactions which those two assertions may elicit depend crucially on different shades of meaning of the word "proud" which come into play, depending on the colour of the person who says it. These different meanings come into play because of the history of oppression associated with these colours; we don't (usually) think in a vacuum. To make this clearer, consider the following, slightly modified thought experiment:
Imagine that a black person says: "I am not ashamed to be black!". Now imagine that a white person says "I am not ashamed to be white!". How strong is the knee-jercky reaction now? Think about it.
Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit
#486If allegations of non-employee/founder wife scenario is true, I would hope the board shows said founder the door. Beyond being in bad taste, it's exposing the company to some serious liabilities...
What's the big deal? I am not a lawyer and I have no idea of the issues involved here, but surely if she was now made an employee and given a salary of $0, the fact that she was a significant investor (via her husband's shares) would make her relatively high-ranking within the company. So yes legally the fact that she didn't have that piece of paper (an employment contract) might matter, but why should it matter morally?
Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit
#487I can't believe that no one has spotted that she is exactly the same annoying feminist that forced the company to get rid of a rug because it used the term "meritocracy". http://readwrite.com/2014/01/24/github-meritocracy-rug#awesm... Tbfh, she sounds like Adria Richards v2.0
Holy shit, that is fucking hilarious!! It's like you know it's going to be her before you open the article, in the back of your mind, "Wasnt there some other sexist nonsense generated by Github a few months back with crazy feminists involved?". Yes mind, yes there was, and it's the same fucking attention whore.
So, as with these outrageous stories there is always a highly commented /g/ thread.
http://boards.4chan.org/g/res/40840868
I'd say it supplies much needed contrast to this thread's aversion to calling this chick out on her flawed character.
Githubs image is being crushed. Schadenfreude. They only need to grow a backbone.
Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit
#488Earlier quoted context omitted.
And yet, she initiated that chain of events. You should think more carefully about what the word "power" means.
Are you aware of how patronising this response is? If you want to make a comment about the nature of power, make it. Don't tell me to think more carefully. I'm not sure precisely which event you're saying she initiated, but if you're talking about her quitting her job and then speaking out like this: you should think about why someone would put their reputation and livelihood on the line.
"If you are one of the people in this thread jumping to defend GitHub in this situation, ask yourself why."
"If you want to make a comment about [...], make it. Don't tell me to think more carefully."
Pot, meet kettle.
Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit
#489Earlier quoted context omitted.
I've seen similar fallouts in a strictly hierarchical organization when one of the leading managers started having an affair with one of the lower rank project management trainees. HR was powerless, since the manager outranked them. Project management was powerless since the now-de-facto promoted trainee was backed by their superior. In the end, the developers revolted and threatened to quit, so the owner personally…
The manager was allowed to stay?
Yes. Atmosphere in the company was pretty toxic after
that event.
Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit
#490Sf is not a good place to be a n00b manager