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Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

reuters.com

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Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#481

Post by bborud »

bebe83939 wrote: post #465
bborud wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So now you are arguing what? That the AI tools, that so thoroughly failed to educate you on education, should be used to teach immigrants in their mother tongue? And keep in mind, if you move to a country you kind of have to accept that they won’t be able to offer you education in every possible language. In fact, learning the language is often a prerequisite for permanent residency. I am not going to ask you how you…

we clearly disagree on many things. People from EU already have residency in Norway, and some are not planning to stay there permanently. One reason to avoid native language (outside of waste of time), is to avoid Barnevernet. It is much harder to take child away from parents, into permament Norwegian foster care, if it does not even speak local language.

So let me see if I get this: we need AI in Norwegian schools so immigrants don’t have to learn Norwegian or English, or else child protective services will take away their children?

It isn’t so much that you and I disagree. It is more that you disagree with reality. To the extent you are aware of reality.

Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#482

Post by master-lincoln »

kelseyfrog wrote: post #408
tacomagick wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So your solution is to deanonymize the whole internet? Also can't teenagers ever vent? I would much rather them use websites such as Reddit or Facebook to socialize instead of Instagram or Tiktok to just scroll endlessly. We should target the social media apps for their predatory algorithms I believe.

Come up with a solution that works instead of a slogan. The last person who divulged any details about what he meant when he said 'parents should parent' went on to reveal that parents should learn to manually configure home routers, a solution that is technologically unattainable for most parents. Again I ask, do you have a solution or a slogan?

maybe do not give your kids self-controlled access to devices with internet access?

Of course that isolates them from their peers who have less caring parents that give them access.

Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#483

Post by erelong »

charcircuit wrote: post #48

The traditional schooling system can't stand that they are being outcompeted by AI and are trying to use the government to maintain their monopoly and keep those tax dollars flowing.

Pretty much; as people experience AI work better than the previous arrangement it will simply be adopted and this antiquated approach will likely be phased out

Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#484

Post by lelanthran »

galkk wrote: post #469
lelanthran wrote: post #440

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And now I need to either disable everything or figure out how to turn that off for her. Why? I tell me 6yo "That's for adults only, children are not allowed to use it" and not have to worry. Sure, he'll push boundaries here and there, but with some things he knows "No means no" and doesn't push those boundaries. I have literally tested this: left a cookie on the table (that he wants) and told him "You can eat that…

It’s okay to pat yourself on the back sometimes, but you have 0 idea about me/my kid, if she’s neurotypical or neurodivergent. So I suggest to keep unasked parental advices or expectations how other kids should behave to yourself.

> So I suggest to keep unasked parental advices or expectations how other kids should behave to yourself.

Forget it. Not gonna happen, on a story about kid's development, in a thread about lack of impulse control.

Sure, there could be physiological reasons for a given child to have a lack of impulse control, but in practice most of a child's characteristics are going to be from the environment.

Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#485

Post by erelong »

spoaceman7777 wrote: post #213

Am I imagining things, or are all of the "vaguely pro-AI" comments being brigaded into oblivion? I can't remember ever seeing this many reasonable posts being downvoted to the point of greying out.

HN is an extremely biased hivemind like Reddit

The anti-AI stance seems like a fashionable contrarianism, not sure what will end up changing it

What's really interesting to me is seeing people who are pro-technology but anti-AI, like... if you're anti-tech, you become something like the Amish. If you're pro-tech, AI is the logical next development along that path of technology - whatever tech you preciously enjoyed, was part of the package deal of building this AI that we now see.

So I guess I am curious to see if more anti-AI people become something like the Amish or if they come to terms with their championing of technology being equivalent to embracing AI.

Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#486

Post by graemep »

Jakob wrote: post #255
JimsonYang wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Facing a broad decline in education test scores, the government in 2024 banned smartphones from schools and has given teachers back more powers to enforce discipline in the classroom. I remember seeing an nyt article where there was mixed results on cell phone bans. While they increased socialization among students, the school didnt see better test scores. We'll have to see if a ban on AI can improve test scores-I…

I would see that as an absolute win. Socialization is the main point I send my kids to school. Socialization leads to discourse which leads to learning.

British schools are often pretty clear that kids are not there to socialise - they will say it in so many words.

It also depends what you by socialisation. in terms of school people usually mean two distinct things: have opportunities to spend time in social interactions, and learning social skills.

My experience of taking kids out of school is that the first reduces (because they spend less time with other kids each day) but the second increases (because they meet a greater variety of people in a grater variety of places).

That takes me to my greatest concern with AI. That kids will socialise (in both senses) with AI rather than people. What will that do to their social skills? There are plenty of examples of adults doing that (visible in places like /r/MyBoyfriendIsAI ), but at least they grew up developing some social skills. If AI is a big part of your interactions, what will the effects of that be?

Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#487

Post by erelong »

garganzol wrote: post #26

I already saw it in my life: a ban on calculators, a ban on computers. But after a short period of rejection, everybody starts to embrace the new tech. Instead of bans we were getting computer classes in schools.

The opposition is a fad that will pass; until then I guess people could investigate workable ways to use AI in the circumstances people object to

Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#488

Post by graemep »

asdff wrote: post #258
baq wrote: post #14

AI used to write homework should be banned. AI in 1:1 tutor mode with proper hardware (live scanning pen and paper), harness and guardrails should be wildly successful (in terms of education outcomes) especially in elementary school.

Tutor mode sucks because even if it was actually accurate and didn't hallucinate, it isn't scoped to what the class is actually covering within a given topic. Best AI is still your own brain, trained on paying attention in class and reading the assigned content.

One to one human tutors are the best way of educating kids and they are not scoped to what a class is covering. They teach the kid as an individual: they are effective because they can adjust to the kids abilities and interests.

Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#490

Post by erelong »

FloorEgg wrote: post #6

Wouldn't it matter a lot how AI is being used? I would assume if children are allowed to use AI without rails as a shortcut it will undermine their learning, and it's used for feedback and as a patient tutor it would accelerate their learning? It seems like the problem is that they don't have the science and tooling to use it constructively at scale, so the desperate solution is to ban it outright until a scalable co…

I think soemthing ignored in the discussion is that there are "good" students who can make use of AI to further their learning versus "bad" students who use AI as a crutch that prevents them from learning well

Acknowledging this divide exists would come down to individual parenting and assessment of a student's use of the tools, rather than a blanket ban of AI tools which punish the "good" students

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