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Nvidia's RTX 5090 power connectors are melting

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Re: Nvidia's RTX 5090 power connectors are melting

#481

Post by state_less »

userbinator wrote: post #56
readingnews wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> Connectors are actually extremely difficult to make. While your points listed are valid, we have been making connectors that overcome these points for decades, in some cases approaching the century mark. >> I'm not surprised at all that they are running into issues here, these cards are pulling 500+ watts. That is a LOT of current. Nonsense. I used to work at an industrial power generation company. 500W is _nothin…

One word: cost. Look up how much industrial/automotive connectors cost, and you'll see the huge difference in quality.

They could use a common XT90 or something similar. You find high amperage connectors on all the RC lipo batteries and they are cheap enough, you find them on $100 products (batteries).

I regularly work with 100amp+ at 12v. It’s obvious the connector NVidia is using is atrocious and we all know it.

Re: Nvidia's RTX 5090 power connectors are melting

#482

Post by anticensor »

mpreda wrote: post #117
Kirby64 wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Until the US changes their AC power connectors, we just don’t have a use case for it frankly. When the entire system is going to always top out at 1200W or so (so you have an extra few hundred watts for monitors and such), we’re pretty limited to maximum amperage.

Now I must use lots of rather thick cables in my desktop (because I run GPUs). Imagine that the GPU would instead suck up all the power it needs through the PCIe connector, without all those pesky cables. (right now PCIe can provied 75W at 12V, i.e. 6.25A; that same current would provide 300W at 48V).

Card-edge connectors are wattage-bound, they would still be limited at somewhere about 100W if upvolted to 48V.

Re: Nvidia's RTX 5090 power connectors are melting

#483

Post by snuxoll »

lazide wrote: post #452
snuxoll wrote: post #391

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not a criticism, but a question. Did you consider adding a subpanel? If you're running a new circuit I assume there was already some drywall patching to be done, seems like it would have been more cost effective and removed future headaches to just give yourself more breaker space.

At least in the US, a sub panel is an easy grand or two even if it’s right next to the main panel.

A lot is going to depend on labor rates for your local electricians, but that costing more than $500 where I am would be outrageous. I do my own electrical, but even I paid a licensed electrician to come handle installing a new panel since I did not have an outdoor service disconnect and didn't feel like fighting with the utility company over de-energizing and re-energizing my service. Ended up needing a lot more done, but the whole thing cost me $2500 to get a new service drop, outdoor meter main, and wiring run to the old panel (in the bedroom on the other side of the main) and the new panel (in the old furnace closed that's now my electrical / network room).

But really, doing a subpanel yourself to expand breaker capacity is a really simple project - most people if so inclined could do it themselves. Anywhere from $100-200 for the panel itself depending on how many spaces you feel like adding, up to $80 for a large enough breaker to feed it, and some tens of dollars for SER cable.

Re: Nvidia's RTX 5090 power connectors are melting

#484

Post by anticensor »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #21
colechristensen wrote: post #6

If we’re going to keep up these kilowatt scale cards, we’re just going to need higher voltage rails on PSUs. I had a bunch of similar dumb power connector problems when my 4090 was new.

Is it effective to step down from 24/48 volts to the 1-2 range? Or would cards need two stages of voltage conversion?

What if we added one more stage, making it into 230V→24V→5V→1.2V?

Re: Nvidia's RTX 5090 power connectors are melting

#485

Post by anticensor »

lazide wrote: post #76
colechristensen wrote: post #6

If we’re going to keep up these kilowatt scale cards, we’re just going to need higher voltage rails on PSUs. I had a bunch of similar dumb power connector problems when my 4090 was new.

Or just give up and provide a wall power cord.

You mean ATX230VO.

Re: Nvidia's RTX 5090 power connectors are melting

#486

Post by ryao »

aaronmdjones wrote: post #394
ryao wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Server systems already work like this for redundancy.

No they don't. Server-grade redundant PSUs usually use a CRPS form factor, where individual PSU modules slot into a common multi-module PSU housing known as a PDB (power distribution board). Each module typically outputs only 12V and the PDB manages the down-conversion to 5V, 5VSB, and 3.3V. From there, there is only one set of power cables between the PDB and the system's components including the motherboard and any…

You can have the machine draw twice the amount from the server PSUs. It kills the redundancy, but it is supposed to work.

Re: Nvidia's RTX 5090 power connectors are melting

#488

Post by aaronmdjones »

ryao wrote: post #486
aaronmdjones wrote: post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No they don't. Server-grade redundant PSUs usually use a CRPS form factor, where individual PSU modules slot into a common multi-module PSU housing known as a PDB (power distribution board). Each module typically outputs only 12V and the PDB manages the down-conversion to 5V, 5VSB, and 3.3V. From there, there is only one set of power cables between the PDB and the system's components including the motherboard and any…

You can have the machine draw twice the amount from the server PSUs. It kills the redundancy, but it is supposed to work.

But that still only happens over one set of power cables, from the PDB. The post you replied to described using a separate PSU with separate component power cables to power specific components. Current sharing in server PSUs is handled by every PSU equally powering all of the components.

Edit: For example, in a 3+1 redundant setting, 3 PSUs would be active and contributing toward 1/3 of the total load current each; 1 PSU would be in cold standby, ready to take over if 1 of the others fails or is taken offline.

Re: Nvidia's RTX 5090 power connectors are melting

#489

Post by ProllyInfamous »

lsaferite wrote: post #470
ProllyInfamous wrote: post #421

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Retired electrician's comments: Most of the US utilizes the NEC for installation compliance. Per NEC, 15A-style outlets are "to code" on 20A circuits unless a single recepticle ("dedicated") circuit — in which case a 20A-style recepticle MUST be installed. For any electric appliance (including computers) which operates for 3hrs+ ("continuously"), the circuit rating is reduced to 80% capacity (e.g. only 16A load allow…

> For any electric appliance (including computers) which operates for 3hrs+ ("continuously"), the circuit rating is reduced to 80% capacity That's a new one for me. Do you have a reference for that? I'd love to read more.

NEC§210.20(A) a/k/a "80% Load Rule"

As trade practice, certain applications are ALWAYS deemed "continuous," e.g. water heaters, computers, space heaters, general lighting.

Re: Nvidia's RTX 5090 power connectors are melting

#490

Post by ryao »

engineer_22 wrote: post #123
Kirby64 wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m aware we have 240V outlets. They are just not used in a place where you would put a PC. Until there is a shift in need (I.e., every normal user would need more than a 120V plug could handle), you won’t ever see 240V outlets in offices. I suspect it will never happen. In server areas and extremely specialized stuff? Yea, sure. But we’re talking desktop PCs here.

I envy my European friends' 240v electric kettles

It is odd that having 240VAC outlets installed in kitchens for kettles has not caught on. A NEMA 6-15R would allow for parity.
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