Israel, Hamas reach ceasefire deal to end 15 months of war in Gaza • Hacker News Board

Re: Israel, Hamas reach ceasefire deal to end 15 months of war in Gaza

#481

Post by halflife » Thu, Jan 16, 2025, 5:31 AM UTC

pydry wrote: post #93

halflife wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The entirety of Hamas leadership is gone, Hamas will most likely not going to have control in Gaza (still being debated which mechanism will govern, this is part of the deal), the crossing to Egypt will be handled by foreign countries which will prevent weapon smuggling. And in the broader spectrum, hizballah is not more, Assad is no more, all of Iran’s proxies can no longer support Hamas’ ambitions which basically m…

[flagged]

Damn if you do damned if you don’t.

Israel approved money from Qatar to flow into Gaza as a goodwill, trust establishing gesture, and as part of previous ceasefire agreements. It was supposedly used to pay salaries for the Gaza government. Was it wrong in hindsight? Of course. Was it used to create division? No.

Re: Israel, Hamas reach ceasefire deal to end 15 months of war in Gaza

#482

Post by sudosysgen » Thu, Jan 16, 2025, 5:31 AM UTC

robertoandred wrote: post #306

gravisultra wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not true at all. The current conflict isn't some thousand year old feud. It was very much caused by the deliberate provocation and importation of European settlers via Zionism. It's easy to wave our hands and say "it's so complicated!" or "they've been doing this for thousands of years!" but it's not complicated, much like apartheid South Africa, Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan were not complicated. Colonialis…

Going to pretend that Jews haven’t lived there for thousands and thousands of years, before the Arabs arrived?

Arab is not a race. Most Arabs never arrived from anywhere, they were locals who adopted (often violently, sometimes not) large parts of Arab culture for long enough to consider themselves Arabs.

The Arabians never had the resources or population to engage in settler colonialism you are thinking of. Even if they wanted to (and perhaps they did), they just couldn't go around replacing anyone. So from the start the conception of Arab is about peoples slowly becoming Arab, not being replaced by arriving Arabs, in large part.

Re: Israel, Hamas reach ceasefire deal to end 15 months of war in Gaza

#483

Post by colordrops » Thu, Jan 16, 2025, 5:37 AM UTC

boringg wrote: post #223

xg15 wrote: post #21

Everything else aside, this is an absolutely fantastic development and I really hope the ceasefire holds and all hostages are released. I just fear this will cause western media and politicians to and declare the crisis to be over (after it had began on Oct. 7, of course absolutely out of the blue and without any context...) and go back to pretending everything is back to normal. Never mind that Gaza is still in ruin…

While this is a good development. Everything in this part of the world is on a rinse snd repeat cycle ever since the Assyrians and the Babylonians - it hasn't changed much except maybe its actually a little more humane then it was in the past (which says something). Sorry for the cynical take but this just does a temporary stop.

Where has it not been on rinse and repeat. Some other parts of the world just operate on a bit longer cycles.

Re: Israel, Hamas reach ceasefire deal to end 15 months of war in Gaza

#484

Post by jhanschoo » Thu, Jan 16, 2025, 5:38 AM UTC

pcthrowaway wrote: post #148

xg15 wrote: post #21

Everything else aside, this is an absolutely fantastic development and I really hope the ceasefire holds and all hostages are released. I just fear this will cause western media and politicians to and declare the crisis to be over (after it had began on Oct. 7, of course absolutely out of the blue and without any context...) and go back to pretending everything is back to normal. Never mind that Gaza is still in ruin…

OK since no one else has said it yet, "according to a source familiar with the details"[1] (I know) Trump has basically told Netanyahu to agree to the ceasefire including the return of hostages. Then if they decide to break the ceasefire and go back to relentless bombings, Trump will still continue to support them. So it could be a tactic to get Hamas to release whatever hostages are still alive, then get right back…

Well, we will know within the year how it turns out.

Re: Israel, Hamas reach ceasefire deal to end 15 months of war in Gaza

#485

Post by slt2021 » Thu, Jan 16, 2025, 5:38 AM UTC

robertoandred wrote: post #306

gravisultra wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not true at all. The current conflict isn't some thousand year old feud. It was very much caused by the deliberate provocation and importation of European settlers via Zionism. It's easy to wave our hands and say "it's so complicated!" or "they've been doing this for thousands of years!" but it's not complicated, much like apartheid South Africa, Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan were not complicated. Colonialis…

Going to pretend that Jews haven’t lived there for thousands and thousands of years, before the Arabs arrived?

there are several flaws in your typical zionist argument:

1. jews as a minority have lived in the lands of Filistine and Jerusalem peacefully and coexisted just fine for millennia, before the zionist project.

2. the fact that small minority of jews lived there does not give an excuse to ethnically cleanse the local population of arabs.

3. the claim that modern european jews from Rhine and pale of settlement (AshkeNazi) have any connection to ancient Israelites from 2000+ years ago is laughable. Most genetic analysis proved that it is Palestinians, Jordanian Christians are native to the land, not european settlers from Poland, Lithuania, Belorussia, Ukraine with last names like Mileikowsky (Bibi's actual name), Mabovitch (golda's name) etc.

4. Filistine and Jerusalem did not have a problem with antisemitism and jew hate, UNTIL european settlers showed up. Antisemitism is purely european concept imported into Middle East.

5. All studies have shown that Israel/zionism is a colonial settler project created by Brits to secure Suez Canal from the ottomans. Later it would become American "unsinkable aircraft carrier" in the middle east to bomb and murder oil rich countries in the middle east

Re: Israel, Hamas reach ceasefire deal to end 15 months of war in Gaza

#486

Post by halflife » Thu, Jan 16, 2025, 5:38 AM UTC

kevingadd wrote: post #419

tptacek wrote: post #350

Hamas was offered a ceasefire under exactly the same terms in May, and refused it. Since then: * Ismail Haniyeh, the leader of the Hamas political wing, was killed in Tehran * Yahyah Sinwar, the leader of the Al-Qassam Brigades, was killed in Gaza * Hassan Nasrallah, the leader of Lebanese Hezbollah, was killed in Beirut * Hashem Safieddine, Nasrallah's successor, was killed a week later * Large swathes of Hezbollah'…

Do you think the bombing would have stopped if they took the deal, based on how Israel has historically operated during "ceasefires"? Just curious. I do think they should have taken the deal.

Was Gaza bombed at the 6th of oct? Or before that?

Re: Israel, Hamas reach ceasefire deal to end 15 months of war in Gaza

#487

Post by bjourne » Thu, Jan 16, 2025, 5:40 AM UTC

bigstrat2003 wrote: post #379

boringg wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While this is a good development. Everything in this part of the world is on a rinse snd repeat cycle ever since the Assyrians and the Babylonians - it hasn't changed much except maybe its actually a little more humane then it was in the past (which says something). Sorry for the cynical take but this just does a temporary stop.

I like how even in this thread, you have many people - almost certainly very few of whom have no real stake in the fight - bitterly arguing about who is right and wrong (turning it into a fight about US politics as a bonus). Human nature and tribalism really is a terrible thing sometimes. I agree with you, although I certainly hope you and I are wrong. It would be nice to see people let go of past injustices on both…

> I like how even in this thread, you have many people - almost certainly very few of whom have no real stake in the fight

A popular chant is "The children of Gaza is our children too." Israel has killed up to 5% of Gaza's population and injured ~15%, about half of whom are children. It's not tribalism to be disgusted by such carnage. I don't agree with the claim that we don't have a stake in this fight.

Re: Israel, Hamas reach ceasefire deal to end 15 months of war in Gaza

#488

Post by sudosysgen » Thu, Jan 16, 2025, 5:48 AM UTC

jncfhnb wrote: post #109

lesuorac wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If neither side has really changed what's to prevent them from going to war again? It happened for a reason and unless that reason has changed then one should expect the same outcome.

Hamas was built over a long period by Iran, through Syria. Iran is much weaker than before, Syria is no longer a route to send supplies, and Hezbollah has been gutted.

Hamas was for the vast majority of its existence anti-Iran, and instead was supported by various Sunni groups like the Muslim Brotherhood. Extrapolating convenient conclusions doesn't help anyone.

Re: Israel, Hamas reach ceasefire deal to end 15 months of war in Gaza

#489

Post by Ylpertnodi » Thu, Jan 16, 2025, 5:49 AM UTC

onecommentman wrote: post #361

A meta level comment for dang, I’m upvoting every comment that is being gang-downvoted…independent of the position. This topic, with roots going back millennia, deserves to have all opinions captured and presented, if nothing more than as a snapshot/wave collapse of where the opposing sides sat in 2025. Noting that, ceasefires are wonderful things.

>Noting that, ceasefires are wonderful things.

Rest, and re-arm time.

Re: Israel, Hamas reach ceasefire deal to end 15 months of war in Gaza

#490

Post by jdoliner » Thu, Jan 16, 2025, 5:50 AM UTC

tptacek wrote: post #350

Hamas was offered a ceasefire under exactly the same terms in May, and refused it. Since then: * Ismail Haniyeh, the leader of the Hamas political wing, was killed in Tehran * Yahyah Sinwar, the leader of the Al-Qassam Brigades, was killed in Gaza * Hassan Nasrallah, the leader of Lebanese Hezbollah, was killed in Beirut * Hashem Safieddine, Nasrallah's successor, was killed a week later * Large swathes of Hezbollah'…

There was a lot of contradictory reporting about negotiations and which said had accepted/rejected the deal. But one thing I think is undisputed is that Israel signed because they were pressured to, and is generally not happy with the deal. At least that's what they're saying publicly. Because of that I find it more credible that they were the bigger impediment to getting a deal done.