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GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house

cnbc.com

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Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house

#481

Post by imglorp »

com2kid wrote: post #6
rgovostes wrote: post #3

> GM said in a statement that “... an increasingly competitive robotaxi market” were the reasons for the change. Isn't there basically Google/Waymo and then, seemingly much further behind, Tesla Cybertaxi, Amazon/Zoox, and Uber/Yandex? Cruise allegedly has one of the most sophisticated autonomous driving platforms, and GM's Super Cruise (if they share any tech) is comparable to Tesla FSD. Strange that they would bow…

> Small anecdote: I visited a GM dealership this week and the salesperson told me Super Cruise was not enabled for test drives. The excuse was pretty weak, like the dealership would have to pay for the service or something. GM might have the technology but they are completely bungling the strategy. Sadly this is believable, I've asked to check out things like remote start and control of heating/cooling, and the sales…

The whole dealership system is parasitic, rentseeking, friction. Tesla might have a point here.

Instead of transparently selling a product for fixed price, the dealer system appears based on information asymmetry, haggling, upcharges, finance bullshit, warranty bullshit, subscription bullshit, and many decades of entrenched psyops culture against customers.

On top of that, salespeople are often poorly trained on the products and dealerships seem to have an adversarial relationship with corporate, especially around the corporate website differing from the local story.

And then the dealerships steer you for whatever benefits them. In 2017 I tried to test drive a Chevy Bolt: Motortrend's car of that year. One dealer hadn't even heard of it. Another said he couldn't get one. Another tried to dissuade me from looking at it by dissing the product. Finally I found a knowledgeable dealer that knew the product, had some, and revealed they were easy for all dealers to get in our area: the others were just being obstreperous. Suck.

Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house

#482

Post by sixQuarks »

standardUser wrote: post #19

Waymo needs competition. Who else is even close to being able to provide it? I'd hate to think Tesla is next in line because they haven't even started a commercial pilot program yet.

You have it wrong buddy. Tesla is the one that needs competition, they’re going to have a robotaxi monopoly soon.

Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house

#483

Post by sixQuarks »

nojvek wrote: post #378
boshalfoshal wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it will be Tesla. Regulatory pressures for them just lifted, and they move faster than all the other driverless companies, courtesy of Elon's fairly hardcore mode of operation. It may not be a perfect driving solution (probably 1:1 teleoperator to car in the beginning), but their go to market speed is undeniably better than Waymo et al. Waymo, Cruise, etc have to map out an entire region and have long rollout…

Tesla is a veeeeery distant second. Elon is full gung ho on vision only. They even removed ultrasonic sensors for parking. Tesla even removed radar. Vision only is Tesla’s bet. Meanwhile Waymo bets on jamming the car full of sensors to ensure it has superhuman 360 perception in all conditions with multiple sensor redundancy. Waymo takes safety insanely seriously. Tesla doesn’t care if 100s die in their car while on F…

I can’t wait to see how badly this comment ages

Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house

#484

Post by dagw »

m463 wrote: post #339
com2kid wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Small anecdote: I visited a GM dealership this week and the salesperson told me Super Cruise was not enabled for test drives. The excuse was pretty weak, like the dealership would have to pay for the service or something. GM might have the technology but they are completely bungling the strategy. Sadly this is believable, I've asked to check out things like remote start and control of heating/cooling, and the sales…

> require an app + subscription I would walk away if I saw that.

I would walk away if I saw that.

And that is probably why they go out of their way to not show you that.

Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house

#485

Post by sixQuarks »

kevindamm wrote: post #123
ketzo wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t it kinda the other way around? I feel like the clock starts the first time a CyberCab gives a paid passenger ride, and that seems like quite a ways out — potentially much more than 2 years. And Waymo has that whole time to bring down their costs of construction, learn how to solve problems of scale, and so on. I agree that a CyberCab would have structural advantages if the service were at parity w/ Waymo, but t…

More than that, even -- Waymo is already transitioning to having partners that do the operations & maintenance work while they focus on the tech. I read this as a confidence in the tech timeline, strategy, and maturity. Meanwhile, Tesla's strategy is "hype, ???, deal with it." I know which one I'd back.

I would so love to do a bet with you, easy money. I’ll even take 2 to 1 odds

Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house

#486

Post by calciphus »

barrkel wrote: post #462
loandbehold wrote: post #439

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you claiming manufacturing an EV emits as much CO2 as driving ICE for 100 000 km? That's really hard to believe, you need to cite your sources.

You will have to factor in the CO2 cost of electrical generation mix. The tradeoff will vary widely depending on where you live.

By that logic, also the CO2 footprint of manufacturing and transporting the fuel for an equivalent ICE vehicle, which is always conveniently left out of such calculations.

Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house

#487

Post by [deleted] »

sixQuarks wrote: post #480
jeremyjh wrote: post #470

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its needed another 9 months for about 5 years now. Tell me, was it also for political reasons that Tesla stopped reporting disengagement data?

The difference is that it’s not Elon saying this anymore. It’s the actual beta testers, and other people that work at Tesla saying this. The Elon hate is so ingrained here, people are ignoring what’s happening right in front of their eyes.

[deleted]

Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house

#488

Post by gitfan86 »

sixQuarks wrote: post #480
jeremyjh wrote: post #470

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its needed another 9 months for about 5 years now. Tell me, was it also for political reasons that Tesla stopped reporting disengagement data?

The difference is that it’s not Elon saying this anymore. It’s the actual beta testers, and other people that work at Tesla saying this. The Elon hate is so ingrained here, people are ignoring what’s happening right in front of their eyes.

Yes that is what i'm saying but people still have the "I HATE ELON" blinders on and can't think for themselves.

Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house

#489

Post by jcgrillo »

kranke155 wrote: post #419
jcgrillo wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not a different question. Passion projects that aren't profitable don't last. It doesn't matter what a technology can do if there's no reason to use it.

Youre just ignoring everything that was said and repeating whatever it is youd like to believe.

No. The big automakers are abandoning this idea. Why? Because they don't see a path to profit. They've been at this for 120+ years. Their judgment is probably better than some ads company with an automotive side project.

Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house

#490

Post by base698 »

bradfa wrote: post #459
epolanski wrote: post #391

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmmm, not when it comes to car. Salespeople are always trained on the latest features in the auto industry. Even if they don't get in person training, all carmakers release 1 hour long videos showing the features of their cars for training purposes.

I've bought a bunch of new cars in my life. I've never had a sales person who knew basically anything about the cars they were selling me. I have however had a variety of very good salespeople, their value has never been in explaining the car to me but in making my purchase transaction straight forward and reasonably quick. All of the sales people could tell me how many doors each car had and what color it was when w…

Concur. A Toyota salesperson was once unable to tell me what the highest trim level of a Highlander was and how it differed from the model they had. Seen staggering lack of knowledge in all things, not just tech.
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