Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Notes on Vision Pro

notes.andymatuschak.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

481–490 of 700 posts

Re: Notes on Vision Pro

#481

Post by layer8 »

hparadiz wrote: post #349
jb1991 wrote: post #315

I use quite a few Apple products every day of the last 10 years, and I’m very impressed with certainly all the technology and reviews and explanations of how this device works and what the user experience will be. However, this is the first Apple device that really makes me pause. All of the marketing material, the WWDC videos, all of it feels very uncomfortable to see all these people isolating themselves in a room…

I don't know if you've ever seen Serial Experiments Lain. In it the protagonist slowly descends into an underground of hackers while finding herself isolated in a room with all sorts of mid 90s aesthetic crt monitors, servers, tubes and wires. And that is more what my current office looks like as opposed to someone hanging out on a couch wearing this headset. If the user interface is to be believed you can in theory…

I think the (standing-)desktop setup with keyboard, mouse, and monitor(s) is already close to the ergonomic optimum for any kind of work that is heavily text based (from Excel sheets to technical and prose writing to coding to email and chat, and forums like here), despite the ergonomic shortcomings that remain. (The one exception being pure reading or markup tasks, where tablet-style devices are great.) Our bodies haven’t really evolved for written communication, but it’s nevertheless still the most effective in many ways, given how our hands and eyes work. I don’t think there is any dystopia in it. Rather, we should embrace it for the many purposes it is effective for, and work to improve it within its paradigm, rather than chasing a fantasy of replacing it with somehow more intuitive or natural means, which generally turn out to only be good for casual or low-text use.

Re: Notes on Vision Pro

#482

Post by jsjohnst »

swader999 wrote: post #433
tromp wrote: post #424

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if anyone will feel brave enough to wear this on a bike... Until the time they're arrested for using a smartphone while biking, or for relying on the computer not to malfunction just to avoid riding blind.

Skiing was what I was wondering.

Recon Jet made an HMD that is sorta similar to Google Glass, but designed more like ski goggles / sunglasses. One of its use cases when it came out around ten years ago was skiing, but I never used it for that. I mainly used mine biking with its ANT+ integration.

Re: Notes on Vision Pro

#483

Post by yurishimo »

bluescrn wrote: post #372
danielbln wrote: post #348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple's goal is surely to get away from the google form factor asap, and once we're at a pair of slick glasses I don't think you'd even think twice about it.

It feels like another pretty Apple device which is purely for consuming content, and of little use for serious work (or serious play). And $3500 is way too much to pay for that sort of device. A UI that relies entirely on eye tracking and arm motion tracking, without a single button for 'accept' or 'back' or 'fire' in the case of games seems incredibly limiting. They didn't demonstrate text entry, did they? I expecte…

I don't think anyone seriously expects the price to stay at $3500 forever. If the first gen product is successful enough to warrant a gen 2, I suspect by Gen 3 we'll see a more approachable price point.

The biggest hint for this is the name: "Vision 'Pro'". Why call something "Pro" that doesn't build on another product to enhance it with other features? The pro moniker for Apple has always been a sign of increased functionality for power users.

Mark my words; we will see a mass-market consumer focused version of this product within 5 years if gen 1 is a success.

Re: Notes on Vision Pro

#484

Post by brookst »

landhar wrote: post #400
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It'll become accepted I'm sure, if it breaks through; could anyone have imagined walking into a living room 30 years ago [0] and seeing everyone hunched over a phone? Or 80 years ago and seeing everyone around a television? I mean I get what you mean, but I also think that some things get normalized in subsequent generations. Our 15 year old and his gf have their phones out at all times, frequently switching to inter…

> could anyone have imagined walking into a living room 30 years ago and seeing everyone hunched over a phone? True, but I don't recall smartphones ever being unveiled with promotional videos of people all being hunched over them at dinner. Smartphones were promoted by enabling us to do things on the go: making and receiving phone calls, getting directions, finding restaurants in the area. This is why this feels diff…

I’m confused. Are we judging a product category based on how it’s promoted, or how it’s used?

I don’t think my opinion of smartphones would be any different if early promotions had shown the downsides, or bigger upsides, or bizarre and unrealistic scenarios. Am I wrong to be anchored on how they’re actually used, which literally nobody foresaw?

Re: Notes on Vision Pro

#485

Post by brookst »

maaaaattttt wrote: post #477
jb1991 wrote: post #315

I use quite a few Apple products every day of the last 10 years, and I’m very impressed with certainly all the technology and reviews and explanations of how this device works and what the user experience will be. However, this is the first Apple device that really makes me pause. All of the marketing material, the WWDC videos, all of it feels very uncomfortable to see all these people isolating themselves in a room…

The 3D spacial capture will ne done on the iPhone in one or 2 generations. I would bet a lot of money on that. That way Apple’s almost certain that all Vision Pro owners will upgrade their phones. They just couldn’t show it captured that way yet as it’s not yet available on the iPhone.

iPhones have had lidar for years.

Re: Notes on Vision Pro

#486

Post by chrbr »

lodovic wrote: post #261
kalleboo wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

VR gaming is a flop. Lots of people bought headsets, played with them for a day and now they're all gathering dust. Apple is right to ignore it.

VR gaming is a niche. Racing and flight simulators are very good; other software is typically mediocre. But VR games do not work with AR glasses.

Even with my racing sim rig, I find myself using my curved monitor more than the Quest 2. It's just such a pain to re-calibrate and update the software and tweak my graphics settings every time I want to hop in that I usually just don't bother.

Re: Notes on Vision Pro

#487

Post by brookst »

lm28469 wrote: post #386
dwayne_dibley wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't disagree, however when was the last time you walked into a room where at least one person wasn't solely focused on their phone. The 3D photo thing is super weird, they could release a stand alone camera in future, BUT, I think this is a v1 product, imagine where it'll be in 5 years time, or an SE model which isn't wrap around. I already wear glasses so having AR glasses is no big leap.

> however when was the last time you walked into a room where at least one person wasn't solely focused on their phone. Do we want more of that ?

Does it matter what “we” want?

If you want to use your phone less, use your phone less. Complaining about how other people use their phones “too much” is just kids-these-days.

Re: Notes on Vision Pro

#488

Post by layer8 »

danielbln wrote: post #348
jb1991 wrote: post #315

I use quite a few Apple products every day of the last 10 years, and I’m very impressed with certainly all the technology and reviews and explanations of how this device works and what the user experience will be. However, this is the first Apple device that really makes me pause. All of the marketing material, the WWDC videos, all of it feels very uncomfortable to see all these people isolating themselves in a room…

Apple's goal is surely to get away from the google form factor asap, and once we're at a pair of slick glasses I don't think you'd even think twice about it.

That’s the fantasy vision, but I don’t see how it would be achievable within the next 15-20 years given the current technological outlook and considering the energy requirements and the necessary optical workings. It will require major technical breakthroughs that aren’t remotely on the horizon.

Re: Notes on Vision Pro

#489

Post by uxp100 »

Interesting to read that the iOS 7 depth/parallax effect was tried all over the UI. It makes sense to indicate interactivity in a better way, but probably the right call to ditch that.

Re: Notes on Vision Pro

#490

Post by grncdr »

sumedh wrote: post #466
acdha wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many industrial design projects has he done, though? He doesn’t have any particular expertise in the area so while it’s fair to ask why they picked the trade-offs they did, it’s pretty far-fetched to think one of the best industrial design teams in the world forgot about a primary success factor, especially given how much other effort they made to hit weight targets. Absent someone who’s actually worked in the fi…

> one of the best industrial design teams in the world forgot about a primary success factor, Is this the same team who came up with a phone that bends in the pocket?

And a wireless mouse that can't be used with the charge cable plugged in...
Post reply on HN