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Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

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Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#481

Post by sudosysgen »

throwaway29812 wrote: post #262
gorwell wrote: post #214

Did anyone notice that the bill doesn't even mention Tiktok??? If it's a "bill to ban TikTok" why doesn't it name the target? It's a red herring. This is the Patriot Act for the Internet. Ironically they're copying the CCP playbook and want the same level of sweeping control with the implementation of a Great Firewall. It's extremely broad and includes everything connected to the internet that has >1M users in a year…

> the same level of sweeping control with the implementation of a Great Firewall The same level ?

From a layman's reading of the bill, it would require ISPs to set up bans for arbitrary foreign websites, and it would impose harsh penalties on entities enabling any bypass. Whether it is used to its fullest extent cannot be known, but if the President wanted to, this bill would allow them to ban any major foreign website and would require companies to effectively set up a firewall. In theory, it could be applied to be even more severe than the Great Firewall, depending on how you interpret certain sections.

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#482

Post by lazyeye »

kelseyfrog wrote: post #452
lazyeye wrote: post #436

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly and young people lack the life experience to comprehend the long-term risks associated with surrendering their private data to the CCP or being exposed to sophisticated disinformation campaigns over time. So it is incumbent on the govt to protect their long-term interests. And to also ensure that trade relationships are fair and equitable (which it currently isnt).

I fail to see how free markets work if people aren't rational actors. We might as well have a communist economy if we can't count on that. Besides, anytime we see the government intervene on matters like this, we're reminded how they make it worse.

Or we may as well have no laws because people are completely rational actors no matter their age etc...

And you didn't address my point with respect to young people's lack of life experience. Or that trade relationships should be fair and equitable.

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#484

Post by kelipso »

withinboredom wrote: post #424
throwaway29812 wrote: post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anecdote Your experience is not everyones experience. For example, the country you describe has 0% resemblance to the one I know. Why should your experience matter more than mine? Are you actually proposing that your experiences are in some way typical ?

Every American expat I know has a similar-ish process where they have to get over the fear/anxiety from living in the US. It’s a proper dinner topic. So yes, I assume it’s typical. Perhaps not 1:1, but there are always similar elements. Edit to add: everyone says they never noticed it while living there. They only noticed it after the first few months/years when it was no longer present.

I have experienced this every time I go out if the country for two weeks and come back. Main thing I notice is the fear I sense in people whenever cops are nearby, and definitely the sense of this security state hovering over everyone. The feeling of personal freedom I have feels like it gets wrenched away whenever I enter the US. The talk of freedom in America is basically cope for having no personal freedom. Wherever you go there's some security fuck hovering around watching and waiting for you to fuck up.

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#486

Post by Hilarity1 »

gonehome wrote: post #478
Hilarity1 wrote: post #470

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TikTok is one vehicle for influence - and there are hundreds. Millions use TikTok. To them, you’re not removing their “adversary”, you’re removing their fun. From the outside, this looks like the United States is controlling the media - something it’s already accused of by 1/2 of Americans. This action will reiterate that for some and make it true for more.

New accounts on issues like this always make me wary of the 50cent party (kind of a case-in-point example of the kind of nation state influence operations and risk). [0] It shouldn’t have gotten to this level, but it’s where we are. Users will move to reels or something else that takes its place without the national security risk. [0]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/50_Cent_Party

I don’t even know what “reels” is. TikTok clone?

And, yeah, I can see the apprehension regarding the new account.

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#487

Post by rumblerock »

olkingcole wrote: post #421
alexose wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> China's seemingly made a point of outsourcing their most polarizing algorithmic decisions to the rest of the world but not to their own population Exactly. We're a decade into the social media experiment now, and it's absolutely clear that it in its current form it doesn't make us smarter, it doesn't make us happier, and it doesn't bring us closer. If anything, it makes people sick and it weakens the social fabric.…

Thank you for this comment. I would like to add that social media and foreign manipulation thereof has been demonstrated to be spectacularly capable of affecting peoples' mental states and beliefs and by extension our stability as a country. We haven't figured out how to deal with it yet in a way that balances with our values of free speech and enterprise but a platform with tiktok's pervasiveness taking orders direc…

Exactly. We've already seen the damage that foreign manipulation can cause when they're exploiting the cracks of FB, Twitter, etc. It doesn't take much imagination to think about what the art of the possible is when you can control the system itself.

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#488

Post by [deleted] »

yed wrote: post #476
boomboomsubban wrote: post #465

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While it wouldn't blanket ban VPNs, a VPN is fairly clearly a "communication technology" and a provider could be targeted by this bill. I'm pretty sure they wouldn't even need to do anything malicious, just be large enough and have some malicious users.

The provider would have to be controlled by China or other designated foreign adversary, and they would indeed have to be doing something determined to be a serious threat to the US.

[deleted]

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#489

Post by ipaddr »

vkou wrote: post #459
Dalewyn wrote: post #372

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Put more bluntly: Even the likes of Facebook and Google are, ostensibly and ultimately, operating for western interests. The likes of Tiktok operately strictly for Chinese interests, and Chinese interests do not align with western interests.

Western media firms don't operate for 'western' interests. Fox and friends, for instance, are actively trying to undermine western civilization[1], and I'll be damned if they are doing it for my own good. They operate for their own interests, which are almost always directly at odds with the interests of the people who actually live in the west. [1] I have exactly as much evidence for this as you do for your claim.

You are missing the point or twisting it to put your political view above another. Go back to the start of the thread and try again

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#490

Post by sudosysgen »

yed wrote: post #476
boomboomsubban wrote: post #465

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While it wouldn't blanket ban VPNs, a VPN is fairly clearly a "communication technology" and a provider could be targeted by this bill. I'm pretty sure they wouldn't even need to do anything malicious, just be large enough and have some malicious users.

The provider would have to be controlled by China or other designated foreign adversary, and they would indeed have to be doing something determined to be a serious threat to the US.

The provider would be acting to abet the violation of this act. Whether or not they are Chinese doesn't matter in that subsection. If they were Chinese they wouldn't care about a US fine anyways. It's even possible that one would argue that a user using a VPN to access TikTok would be violating the bill.
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