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Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

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Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#481

Post by throwaway5674 »

GauntletWizard wrote: post #404
throwaway5674 wrote: post #351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A throwaway account... I am a male who was sexually assaulted by another male. Strictly speaking I was raped, but I prefer not to use that term because of the emotive nature of it. There is not much you've said I disagree with, but I do want to show that this goes both ways. I have never made a public accusation about the individual involved in my case because I do not have irrefutable evidence that it wasn't consent…

Teaching "Consent" doesn't work. The monsters who commit sexual assault don't believe in, and in fact cannot comprehend consent. They view it as a checkbox they have to check, a speedbump that once they're over they can ignore. They absolutely love consent education, because they can claim they had consent, and make it a public circus of litigating he-said-she-said. I'm not going to use a throwaway - I am a male who…

I know platitudes do not help, but I am deeply sorry you had to go through this. I wish our stories were less common than they are. No one should have to go through that as a 'learning experience', but yes I feel the same way.

Clearly the only way to really test improved teaching on consent would be to change the education system and then wait 10-20 years to measure the impact once those children become sexually active adults. I don't think such a dataset is a reasonable request unfortunately.

It's interesting your phrasing of referring to people who commit sexual assault as 'monsters'. I do not think of my perpetrator as a monster, I do not believe him to be evil beyond redemption. Sure, there are some mentally ill individuals who do sexual crimes so heinous it is hard to imagine any road to recovery, but I don't believe my experience lies in that category. I personally feel a series of events in his life drove him to make that decision that day, and it is possible as a society to course correct future generations not to make that same decision. I have to believe that.

Do I have any concrete evidence beyond faith? No. Maybe all rapists are monsters born that way, but that is such a frightening concept I just can't accept that that is true.

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#482

Post by Simon_O_Rourke »

sgt wrote: post #267
Simon_O_Rourke wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not quite as damaging, but I was accused of harassment from some blue-haired weirdo on a video call with nearly a hundred people at work. Like you, this was a person I had zero interaction with prior to the call. I considered getting a lawyer involved because I feared this could blow up, but was talked out of it by my boss, who asked me to apologize and "let's leave it at that".

Didn't the 100 people on the call see that it wasn't harassment? What could possibly have happened to make the weirdo think you were harassing him?

Simple - kudos from a VP on a project my team had been working on.

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#483

Post by anonymouskimmer »

Fire-Dragon-DoL wrote: post #276
anonymouskimmer wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. Don't do this unless you have a backup job, or can survive fine for a while on unemployment. If you do want to report the behavior, report the pertinent details to the EEOC (or whatever is equivalent for your country).

Wouldn't the company be in big trouble if they fired you after that email?

They could just not respond at all to the email. They could say the person receiving it didn't understand what the email was asking so deleted it. They could say that the managers never made any such statements and thought the employee (who they would also say had other performance or HR issues) was trying to entrap them, and that they fired the employee for the alleged entrapment.

Document and report. Don't try to catch someone unless you're advised to do so by a lawyer or law enforcement or the like.

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#484

Post by gsich »

dsign wrote: post #314

Homo Sapiens, despite all its culture, it is still commanded by Nature to do everything it can to spread its genes. A (nice) side-effect of that is that we are lewd. The problem is that we loose our composure when we drink. Just playing the devil's advocate here, but let's assume for a minute we could reorganize things a little to avoid matters like this becoming a problem. Like say, we could make women stronger than…

Try some drugs Turing had to take.

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#485

Post by CyberDildonics »

fennecfoxy wrote: post #436
mshake2 wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was groped by an gay (and well-liked) coworker at a company retreat. I told my boss a few weeks later at a 1-on-1 lunch and he just made a face and then awkwardly changed the subject. Most people are cowards and avoid unpopular actions at all costs so that they can keep their power. Virtue is all an act for power.

And as a gay man myself I've been groped by female colleagues before, had them come up and stand behind me and rub my shoulders/squeeze my back completely unwanted and I've done n o t h i n g about it, because nothing can be done about it. That's the sad truth. Can't go to anyone and even if I did, they likely won't believe me, whereas she could retaliate and say I was the one that did the touching and she'd be belie…

I've done n o t h i n g about it

Did you ask them not to do it again?

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#486

Post by giardini »

sokoloff wrote: post #268
HideousKojima wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Billy Graham/Mike Pence rule is your best bet: don't let yourself be in any situation where a false accusation could arise. Of course you'll be accused of being a sexist/misogynist/whatever instead but that's easier to ignore or overcome than false accusations of sexual harassment.

Hard disagree. If I decide I can have a closed-door 1:1 or a lunch 1:1 with some of my direct reports but not with any that are female, I’m inherently discriminating against them. I’d way rather treat all employees fairly and fade a <1% chance of a false accusation than to treat employees unequally and cut that chance in half.

Don't close the door.

Had so many problems in one office that they re-architected it so every office had (at least) a large window. Complaints of hanky-panky dropped to zero.

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#487

Post by naasking »

anonymouskimmer wrote: post #240
wrycoder wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There aren’t many male teachers left.

So you're saying that male teachers disproportionately abuse compared to female teachers?

Or the abuse from male teachers gets more coverage.

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#488

Post by naasking »

seadan83 wrote: post #82
tonfreed wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It shouldn't be a competition. If a man abuses his power over a female (or male, for that matter) employee, then they should have the book thrown at them. The same should apply for women. I hate the level of politicisation over this, it's a shitty thing to do no matter who does it.

It's one of those, "see, woman can do X too, so why are we so focused on only men doing X" Similar too, "white people are shot by cops". Similar to "white people are discriminated against in colleges". The point is true it is shitty no matter. Though, now the conversation is shifted if a person were to focus on root causes of either problem. Overall, false equivalence.

> It's one of those, "see, woman can do X too, so why are we so focused on only men doing X"

And that's exactly correct in this case. The answer is not "ignore or dismiss people who ask about why we don't focus on women doing X", it's "we should investigate women doing X too, because X is wrong no matter who does it".

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#489

Post by giardini »

benj111 wrote: post #403
machina_ex_deus wrote: post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So the justice system built by many intelligent professionals failed, but the dumb mob justice will succeed? It is the lack of religion, because religion is exactly what would fill this gap in the minds of people from seeing injustice. Maybe the earthly judges failed, but I don't need to be cruel and punishing because the criminal will get what's coming for him in the next life. It doesn't even matter if this argumen…

>So the justice system built by many intelligent professionals failed No it was built by people like you and me. You know those useless people in your office? They're also in the judiciary. You know that stupid policy that while it may have some uses, leads to other bad outcomes but no-one can be bothered to fix? That's also present.

So "We're screwed!" is what you're saying?

Is there an alternative?

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#490

Post by Fire-Dragon-DoL »

anonymouskimmer wrote: post #483
Fire-Dragon-DoL wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't the company be in big trouble if they fired you after that email?

They could just not respond at all to the email. They could say the person receiving it didn't understand what the email was asking so deleted it. They could say that the managers never made any such statements and thought the employee (who they would also say had other performance or HR issues) was trying to entrap them, and that they fired the employee for the alleged entrapment. Document and report. Don't try to c…

Oh sure, I implied to sue only if a response was received
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