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Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

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Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#481

Post by acdha »

not_really wrote: post #439
acdha wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re posting this late enough to have had time to see that those are all about hardware which is a decade old. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23796606

Right, so as time progresses news comes out about said hardware being hacked. I think you've validated his point. 5 years from now we will see how today's cameras have been hacked.

This was a known weakness back then, not some amazing breakthrough, and unless the vendors are actively lying about the hardware there's no way for someone to “hack” the power connection without a soldering iron.

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#484

Post by InafuSabi »

Only hard switches can guarantee blocks to equipment. Any soft switch can be overridden.

I use electrical isolation tape on all cams pointed at me, always on androids & even on linux notebooks.

I always physically disconnect mics I dont use, if in notebooks I put a blob on removable glue on them

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#485

Post by christoph »

farnsworth wrote: post #226
dabernathy89 wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It does not have to be a bulky cover. I used an extremely low profile webcam cover on my 2015 MBP for 3 years. I put a similar one on my 16" MBP, and it destroyed the screen after a couple weeks. Specifically, this is the webcam cover I was using: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07C24NBGL/ref=cm_sw_r_sms_apa_i_T...

I used this on the 2016 for years, but even though it's incredibly thin, it is too thick for the 2020. Would love to find a replacement if anyone has a suggestion.

I've been using the same tiny square of black electrical tape for nearly 2 years without issue, just slides across when needed, the tackiness hasn't noticeably degraded in that time, it's barely noticeable to outsiders unless they really look for it and it hasn't let me down yet. When it does let me down, it basically zero cost to replace and it definitely won't crack my screen either :)

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#486

Post by bsder »

inopinatus wrote: post #278
foota wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My threat model doesn't involve someone disassembling my laptop and rewiring it, at that point they might as well just plant a bug.

This isn’t speculation. Opening up hardware to modify the internals is something that covert agencies do, and it’s naive to think that the purpose is equivalent to a simple bug. As someone who posts to Hacker News you are by almost any definition a potential information source or APT vector.

> This isn’t speculation.

He didn't say it was.

What he said was that his threat model doesn't include state agencies. Many people use their laptops in bed and they probably don't want random people using their laptop webcam to take random nudes.

And, while I hear the NSA being quoted a lot, let's be fair, how many of us have the opsec to stand up to a genuine NSA attack?

A reasonable goal in thwarting the NSA should be to stop some random bureaucrat from typing on a few keys and getting access to your stuff without a signature. As long as some bureaucrat has to put their signature on a piece of paper and get budget to get my stuff, I'm safe against random trawling.

Besides, if the NSA really wants you, they'll just fabricate the evidence. It's way cheaper.

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#487

Post by ars »

maerF0x0 wrote: post #204
the-pigeon wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But can't you specifically wire the indicator light to always be lit if the camera has power? I don't see Apple claiming they've done that but a correct design would make the indicator light work that way and be related to software at all. Meaning you could only disable the indicator light by physically modifying the device.

even then there probably should be some minimum "flash" time in that if it turns on and off faster than the LED lights up or human eyes can see then it may still take images faster than we can register? EDIT: a commenter below said "Macs newer than 4 or so years also have a feature that forces the LED to stay lit for at least 3 seconds after it has been turned on to prevent the single-frame-grab attack."

So basically I have to check the light every 3 seconds? That seems .... unrealistic.

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#488

Post by coldtea »

rgbrenner wrote: post #436

As an alternative to a camera cover, use the camera indicator light to determine if your camera is active I've been thinking about privacy all wrong. I thought it was about preventing access to my data... but Apple has cleared up my misunderstanding and now I know that it's just about being notified when my data is stolen. Everyone feel free to post your credit card numbers... your privacy is secure, since your bank…

>I've been thinking about privacy all wrong. I thought it was about preventing access to my data... but Apple has cleared up my misunderstanding and now I know that it's just about being notified when my data is stolen.

This comment makes absolutely zero sense in more ways than one.

First, in the post Apple also says how you can control exactly which apps have access to the camera in the privacy settings. And, like, not give access to any, if you don't feel like so.

Second, the green light is not about "notified when your data is being stolen" is about being informed if/when you are filmed. In which case, you can just close the lid, quit the app, or do anything you like to prevent it.

Your reasoning is like arguing ironically against an alert vendor that "I thought the problem was getting my valuables stolen, but now the vendor has cleared up my misunderstanding and now I know that it's just about being notified when my valuables are stolen".

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#489

Post by mcv »

int_19h wrote: post #444
_kst_ wrote: post #378

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My work laptop (a Thinkpad) has a built-in plastic slider that physically covers the camera. If something activates the camera while that cover is closed, it won't see anything.

Not only that, but this feature is also present in X1, which is plenty thin.

I came here to post exactly this about my X1E. First laptop I've seen that has a builtin slider (though I'm sure there are others).

Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera

#490

Post by asveikau »

xwdv wrote: post #373
alunchbox wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a reason Zukerberg's laptop has its mic and camera tapped up. It doesn't matter what device you use unless there's a physical switch to disconnect it'll never be safe. Software can ALWAYS have zero days, just because it hasn't been exploited yet doesn't mean it can't be.

> There's a reason Zukerberg's laptop has its mic and camera tapped up. Virtue signaling mostly. It’s not difficult to open a laptop and remove those components all together. Especially for someone like Zuckerberg.

Removing components also removes functionality. What if he wants to use it later? I guess he could have another laptop specially for the purpose, he can certainly afford that.

I think the simplest explanation is whoever was staging the scenery around him didn't think anybody would notice the taped laptop. If they did realize that, they probably would have untaped. It wasn't meant to be a detail you notice or centerpiece of conversation. That's my guess.

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