Earlier quoted context omitted.
How about you look at what they actually predicted? https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-how-well-have-climate-m...
That's a useful start. I'll definitely dig into this. The question still stands as to why, even if the problem lay with journalists/media rather than scientists, is why did they get it so wrong? Also, if I as lay person am going to be getting my information from sources like NYT and National Geographic instead of IPCC reports directly, have they fixed the problems that led to the erroneous reporting?
Coronavirus and Credibility
481–490 of 968 posts
Re: Coronavirus and Credibility
#482Earlier quoted context omitted.
The low 200k fatality estimate probably factors in the that the curve is flattening. The current estimate is that 300k people are infected in the US. If the number of people infected by Covid-19 doubles every week, then in 10 weeks there will be 300 million infected in the US. Assuming 1% mortality puts you at 3 million dead.
Doubling each week is not how it happens... as a higher percentage of people have or have had the virus, the growth rate decreases because there are less people available to infect. That is why infection percentage is an s shaped curve.
Re: Coronavirus and Credibility
#483Earlier quoted context omitted.
Musk is still actively downplaying the severity of the situation. Recently he's been signal boosting the idea that many more people are infected than we think and therefore the alarmism is unwarranted
Considering the amount of testing that is actually being done, no one has much ideas of the real number of cases. With any luck he will be right but no one really knows.
Even he doesn't know if he's right, but apparently that doesn't stop him from using his influence to push his hot take.
At this point, the only thing that can be claimed with confidence is our global ignorance of this pandemic, and how much more we have to learn about it.
Re: Coronavirus and Credibility
#484The video linked in that article is a tour-de-force of out of context snippets. Anyone could splice together a video just like that one with material from any TV news network or politician, from the tip of South America to the extremes of Siberia and everything in between.
In many ways, and sadly, PG reveals (perhaps proudly) his own bias on this front. This is very much a hit job on Fox News and the right. One can't claim intellectual superiority and do this at the same time. Sorry.
This isn't to say that Fox News isn't without fault. They are. Everyone is. NOBODY understood this well enough to say anything intelligent about it. NOBODY, from politicians to doctors and, yes, newscasters and celebrities.
What we can say is that nearly everything that was said or predicted during the early phases of this thing by almost everyone has now been proven wrong by this cruel virus and its behavior. That isn't an indication of nefarious intent. Ignorance? Yes. Malicious intent? I doubt it. Political battle? Yes, likely, sadly...because nobody really understood this thing was going to get ugly.
Faulting anyone, from Trump to local officials is, from my perspective, intellectually dishonest and counterproductive. This is where I have a problem with the media. I am sure the founders did not pen the first amendment with the intent of providing protection for extreme political alignment in the media. We have, somehow, allowed this to happen, and, what is worse, we have not come up with a way to curtail it.
Watching US coverage and press conferences is a display of just how politically aligned the media has become. Their focus is, 24/7, to attack the political party they are not aligned with. In order to accomplish this they are more than willing to take things out of context, distort reality, fabricate narratives and disseminate lies. As someone who works hard to remain as neutral as possible, a registered independent who has equal disdain for both major parties, this is truly revolting to watch. Sometimes I feel like a visitor from another planet watching from an orbiting spacecraft while the people below play stupid games to destroy each other rather than unite for the benefit of all. Unbelievable.
While I agree with most of the observations in this article I wish PG had taken the time to find real examples of ignorance without resorting to a left-wing hit piece on the right wing by using an array of out of context pieces cut together.
While I can't be on a spacecraft orbiting above the US, I can take a look at what our approach to COVID-19 looked from other parts of the world. For example, SkyNews Australia:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdKLx5MhTpk
Dr. Oxiris Barbot, Commissioner of the New York City Department of Health herself, was, for some incomprehensible reason, telling New Yorkers to just go out, gather, use subways and change nothing other than wash their hands and stay home if they were sick:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2DetEolgOg
And, before someone says "you took that out of context" (I did not edit the video so...), here's a full press briefing where she goes into clear detail about "no need to do any special anything...":
https://youtu.be/NEhLOp7UGNM?t=1659
I mean, this is the Commissioner of the New York City Department of Health!!!!
I cued-up the video to her statement so you can see and hear it from the horses mouth and confirm what I present above. If interested, I urge you to rewind to the start and watch the entire press briefing. If you do, you'll hear a bunch of good things and a bunch of incomprehensibly bad things, among which are:
- Just like the normal flu
- We should relax
- We don't think it's going to be as bad as it is in other places
We have been ahead of this from day one
• Go about your lives
• Go about your business
• There has to be prolonged exposure
• Just wash your hands
• There is no need to do anything special anything in the community, we want New Yorkers to go about their daily lives, ride the subway, ride the bus, go see your neighbors
• We have the equipment
• It's not like we are dealing with something we haven't dealt with before
• We have the ability to address this
• We have the capacity to keep this contained
• Like the normal fluRe: Coronavirus and Credibility
#485To all of these people and anyone sincerely interested in the topic I'd like to post an interview with Dr John P.A. Ioannidis, a professor of medicine and professor of epidemiology and population health, as well as professor by courtesy of biomedical data science at Stanford University School of Medicine, professor by courtesy of statistics at Stanford University School of Humanities and Sciences, and co-director of the Meta-Research Innovation Center at Stanford (METRICS) at Stanford University, that hopefully sheds the light on the true amount of fear-mongering and plain stupidity in the media right now:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6MZy-2fcBw
Here are some of his thoughts in written form:
https://www.statnews.com/2020/03/17/a-fiasco-in-the-making-a...
As you may see, he is much more reserved about the subject than many of the people in the comments to this submission.
What does this have to do with PG's blog post? Well, PG's post is blatant and dogmatic witch-blaming, while the people, that he is blaming, may actually be right. And they definitely have the right to express their opinion on the subject.
Re: Coronavirus and Credibility
#486Earlier quoted context omitted.
The low 200k fatality estimate probably factors in the that the curve is flattening. The current estimate is that 300k people are infected in the US. If the number of people infected by Covid-19 doubles every week, then in 10 weeks there will be 300 million infected in the US. Assuming 1% mortality puts you at 3 million dead.
Doubling each week is not how it happens... as a higher percentage of people have or have had the virus, the growth rate decreases because there are less people available to infect. That is why infection percentage is an s shaped curve.
Forcing the doubling rate to decrease short of hitting that point requires something else to happen. South Korea clearly did something other than running itself out of cannon fodder.
Re: Coronavirus and Credibility
#487Earlier quoted context omitted.
And they both use the same scare statistics. (covid) 2 million Americans will die. (global warming) If we don't stop emitting CO2 the world will collapse by 2030.
You're exaggerating, which is just as bad. NYT reported that "200,000 to 1.7 million" people could die on March 13th [1]. Most of those calculations had to do with the fact that the hospital system would get overwhelmed at some point, compounding the deaths. None of that is "scare statistics". It's useful modeling. I think what you consider to be "scare statistics" is more lack of education. Similar to how people saw…
With the media, I think it's sometimes intentional and not ignorance, as a ploy to get clicks.
With the anti-media, anti-expert crowd, I have to believe it's usually simple ignorance.
Re: Coronavirus and Credibility
#488Paul is off by a mile and a half on this one. They weren't worried about getting caught. At all. The thing they would be worried about is whether or not getting caught would have consequences. And if there is anything that you could have learned from the last three years then it is that lying to the public carries no consequences at all.
They were on a good trajectory of being put of the business by Youtube. But than "authoritative sources" came.
"Bally Jerry...pranged his kite right in the how's yer father...hairy blighter, dicky-birdied, feathered back on his Sammy, took a waspy, flipped over on his Betty Harper's and caught his can in the Bertie."
Re: Coronavirus and Credibility
#489Earlier quoted context omitted.
You really posted a link to some random blog post, not a peer reviewed journal, not even an expert on the subject? In the year 2020? I'm not even sure where to start because there is just... not enough here to even.. oh forget it.
Here you go pal[0] [0] https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11191-013-9647-9 edit: added missing word.
Re: Coronavirus and Credibility
#490Earlier quoted context omitted.
Simple numbers tell us the deaths so far from covid-19 have been less than an average flu season. But so what? You're not actually suggesting anything so there's nothing to get directly angry about. But since you don't suggest anything, you leave it to people to infer what you really mean, and then there may be good reason to get angry. Are you suggesting that we should have treated covid-19 like the flu -- although…
Since there's no vaccine...what you're suggesting is a perpetual game of Covid whack-a-mole. We come out of quarantine it blows up again, we go back into quarantine. That's as infeasable solution as this current lockdown quarantine.
Epidemiologists are likely to know the answers to these sorts of questions in a few years.