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That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

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Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#481

Post by rorykoehler »

jp555 wrote: post #465
rorykoehler wrote: post #411

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Smartphone != iphone I spent $250 on mine and it is does everything meaningful that an iphone does. Iphone is definitely a luxury even among smartphones.

the delta between your $250 smartphone and a new $400 iPhoneSE is pretty small when you consider the total cost and include the costs to provide the phone with data access - cellular plan + home internet plan. Is $150 the difference between luxury and not luxury for something that is used 4+ hours a day for years?

That $150 extra gets me precisely nothing that I don't already have. Actually it's a lesser phone because mine has a microSD slot that I use. Here's a thought experiment.... send me $150 on paypal now (email on my profile). I'll give you nothing in return. See if you feel like it was money well spent.

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#482

Post by lotharbot »

skywhopper wrote: post #184
noxToken wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I am not sure if I was suddenly without money, the iPhone would be what I would want to give up. If you have an iPhone and then become poor, sure. You probably won't get ahead much by getting rid of your iPhone. If you're already poor, then an iPhone (not a smartphone) is definitely a luxury. There are capable smartphones for much cheaper then an iPhone that could get the job done. That's what GP was likely getting…

> There are capable smartphones for much cheaper then an iPhone that could get the job done. That's what GP was likely getting at. True enough. And yet, if you yourself are not actually poor, you may not realize the value that a marginal luxury like an iPhone or Air Jordans or a top brand purse (sorry, I don't know what the hot brand of purses is atm) can bring to someone in that situation. Spending a few hundred dol…

> "it can get them something that helps them appear less poor to the people around them"

I think it works the opposite -- if I see someone who I think is maybe poor, and they whip out the latest and greatest iPhone or are wearing $200 shoes or overpriced brand-name sunglasses, now I know they're poor. Because it's an obvious status symbol that's not in line with the rest of their lifestyle. Other poor people aren't stupid; they see right through it as well.

Whereas if I see someone who looks poor and they whip out an old Moto X and are wearing shoes from Payless, I assume they're comfortable with whatever economic/social status they have and don't need to try to signal. I view them as immediately more trustworthy and am more willing to cut them a deal, because I assume they're capable of long-term planning rather than impulsive spending.

This might not be 100% accurate, but I find it's a generally effective rule of thumb, and I think a lot of people use it to evaluate.

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#483

Post by mwfunk »

That's reading a lot into a random joke. When some public person makes a pseudorandom comment and you perceive that as a mask being dropped to reveal confirmation of all your darkest suspicions about that person or the people he speaks for, you might be projecting, just a smidgen.

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#484

Post by simonh »

eropple wrote: post #358
simonh wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet Apple devices have longer software support lifetimes than any Android devices and better resale values for a longer time. That hardly sounds like a set of characteristics you'd associate with products designed to become obsolete.

Is Android the right comparison? Because I don't think Android when I think about my barely useful iPad 2 (because Android tablets are tire fires), I think of the Pentium III Thinkpad that I use for distraction-free writing. They're both about as useful to me, and one is as old as a high school sophomore.

Realistically the early iPhones and iPads were an experiment. Nobody really knew what their useful lifetime would be. The same went for Android devices.

In fact the wisely received wisdom was that Android devices would have longer useful lifespans because open source leads to higher quality software that's maintained and updated for longer, which can be customized by users so it meets their needs better. The reality that many Android devices never see a single software update and are junked up with carrier crapware and poor device drivers hidden in binary blobs still hasn't sunk home for everyone yet.

Even now when I buy a new device I think about how useful it will be and what it's support will be like for 2 to 4 years. Beyond that, there's no way to tell. When my kid's original iPad Minis get replaced, if they still work I'll probably just use them as family photo and video galleries.

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#485

Post by mthoms »

kybernetikos wrote: post #420
pc86 wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And my wife and I still use our iPad 2 without issue aside from the noticeable sluggishness switching apps or updating. Anecdotes!

Not sure what your point is. My point was that the original iPad was nearly unusable in less than 3 years. This is not an anecdote, it's a simple matter of fact. The original iPad was launched in mid 2010. In September 2012 Apple released iOS 6, which didn't run on the original iPad. Shortly afterward, the apps we used all required a forced update to their iOS6 version (which of course didn't work) and it became a do…

The first generation of any entirely new category of hardware is always a bit of a gamble.

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#486

Post by bfrog »

Is it really any surprise no one is bothering to keep following the upgrade windmill money shakedown? My 5 year old laptop works just as well with gmail, youtube, and google docs as my 8 year old desktop etc etc. There's very little reason to keep on the upgrade bandwagon right now. The innovation of software has more or less flat lined for the end user machine... for now.

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#487

Post by sametmax »

charlesdm wrote: post #246
ratbeard wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We've got an iPad 2 that is not useless, but much worse after upgrading to ios9. I still play Kingdom Rush games on it but its so slow now its too frustrating to use for internet browsing and other things.

It's one of the reasons why I haven't upgraded my iPad 2 past iOS6. It still streams Netflix great though, but the browser is starting to show its age - I can't load all webpages anymore. :( Looks like I might need to pick up a new iPad..

"Looks like I might need to pick up a new iPad.."

That is insane. I can load all webpages on any laptop from 5 years ago. A browser doesn't become "slower". Even with bigger pages, they are still web pages, not 3D games.

It means the ipad itself is, for some reason, rendering itself slow. And you can't do anything about it because you can't hack it.

And your idea of the solution to the problem is to buy a new one ?

My god, somebody sell you a self-destructing product in order to force you to buy a new one, and you oblige ?

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#488

Post by CaptainZapp »

mirimir wrote: post #422
CaptainZapp wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the clarification. I think it was mostly this statement : Assuming a lifespan of 3 years, the cost difference between a $600 phone and a $300 phone is barely more than $0.25 per day that triggered my response. Rereading it: you're right. I'm still glad to have posted the link :) What really riles me up is that a lot of people have no clue how expensive it actually is to be poor and how hard is it to break…

That's a heart-wrenching list. I love Scalzi's SF, but didn't know that side of him. My parents were poor by any US standard. But basically, I was trained for the Cold War, so hey. I do recall, however, a friend who was raising two kids on her own. With some horrible history of migration etc. She did indeed know the cost of everything. And budgeted carefully, down to the penny.

It's nice that Scalzi "made it" and turned his writing into a successful career.

I really like his blog (sorry John, I guess I'm one of your freeloaders; that's because I'm just not that much into SF)

He seems to be a really decent guy and shows an ability, which is sorely missed nowadays:

Comon Sense.

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#489

Post by rodion_89 »

mwfunk wrote: post #483

That's reading a lot into a random joke. When some public person makes a pseudorandom comment and you perceive that as a mask being dropped to reveal confirmation of all your darkest suspicions about that person or the people he speaks for, you might be projecting, just a smidgen.

Reflects more on him than Apple

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#490

Post by sametmax »

rileymat2 wrote: post #60
waspleg wrote: post #41

I completely agree with the author of the article. Apple is the real-world incarnation of the economic premise of Huxley's "A Brave New World". This was just the mask dropping for a second to pander to the faithful. I'd like to add, as someone who works at K12 public high school, that I've seen the reality of the article played out. My building is 100% free lunch, most are extremely poor, and yet there is a sizable n…

I am not sure if I was suddenly without money, the iPhone would be what I would want to give up. The utility of the device is incredible: Mapping. Phone. Internet. Email. Alarm Clock. Calendaring. Photography. If anything we should work to get smart phones in the hands of the poor. It would be a great way to improve their lives for a somewhat modest cost. I am not sure it is all for looks. Maybe we could quibble abou…

you can live with none of that.

You can have internet at school on a needing basic. You don't need it in your pocket.

You can live without mapping, a dumb phone with alarm clock and be done with it.

If you live by the cent, no, the iPhone is not a priority.

I didn't have a smartphone before 4 months ago, and it was fine. And if you are at school, then it's even easier.

The biggest problem is the social isolation, since now a lot of kids interactions are going through apps.

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