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Can we have the day off?

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Re: Can we have the day off?

#471

Post by dalyons »

madrox wrote: post #382
culi wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's not powered by norms. In the US, if you want to employ someone more than 40 hours you have to give them extra overtime pay. It's called the Fair Labor Standards Act and it was passed in 1938

Unless you are exempt. Guess what profession tends to be considered exempt? If you are a SWE, you don't get paid overtime for working that incident on the weekend or going over 40 hours in a week. The only reason you work five days a week is tradition.

Hence the rise of 996 bs

Re: Can we have the day off?

#472

Post by Chinjut »

afro88 wrote: post #309
fg137 wrote: post #296

I never understand why software engineers are so excited about AI as a whole. If you are excited about the technology, sure. But if you are excited about the increase in productivity, unless you are a manager, I don't really understand it. Like, why? You are not working one hour less than before. If anything, it's more likely you'll get laid off and have trouble finding your next job.

Is the end goal to not work? Are we supposed to not enjoy what we work on? Do we not believe in what the company we work for is trying to achieve?

Many of us do not particularly enjoy the work our employer has us do, nor believe in what the company we work for is trying to achieve. It's not like we get to choose its aims, and it's not like we have alternatives where we get to do so either. Our lives are spent working on someone else's goals.

Re: Can we have the day off?

#473

Post by wombatpm »

rickydroll wrote: post #385
quadrifoliate wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand why people make these hyperbolic jokes about guillotines. Violence is counterproductive; and not practical anyway. Joking about it just makes you feel great without actually doing anything. There is a simple alternative. Vote; and educate your family and friends. If you don't know what is on the ballot in the midterms, you are part of the problem. If you aren't starting a family conversation about…

So you are saying that I shouldn't start my artisanal guillotine business? Believe me, I know what's on the ballot for the midterm in the state but it's not going to stop me from making dark snarky jokes.

Mass produced and pre-staged. Think zipcar for guillotines pre positioned in finance districts and rich neighborhoods.

Re: Can we have the day off?

#474

Post by palmotea »

cattown wrote: post #33

This article is kind of playful, but I think there’s a serious point here that’s not discussed enough. We’re being asked to usher in huge productivity gains by introducing AI to our workflows, but we’re not asking how does it help us? Not a lot of us stand to directly gain from our employers becoming more productive. I know everybody is afraid of getting fired and replaced with AI or whatever right now. But we should…

> This article is kind of playful, but I think there’s a serious point here that’s not discussed enough. We’re being asked to usher in huge productivity gains by introducing AI to our workflows, but we’re not asking how does it help us? Not a lot of us stand to directly gain from our employers becoming more productive.

And we shouldn't. Workers should only get the wages they can command in the marketplace and not a penny more, and the smaller the better.

> I know everybody is afraid of getting fired and replaced with AI or whatever right now. But we should be seriously asking in our next all hands meetings if 10x’ing our productivity can get us some days off. Or when our paycheck is going to be multiplied accordingly.

Morally, all benefits of any technology or productivity gain must flow up to the owners, who deserve it all.

But this should be comforting to all of you. I'm sure everyone here owns at least a few thousand dollars in shares. You'll get some dividends and/or capital gains!

Re: Can we have the day off?

#475

Post by chanux »

porknubbins wrote: post #293
_moof wrote: post #257

Whenever a new way is found to improve efficiency, choices have to be made about how to distribute the new surplus. Choices are made by people who have power and imposed upon people who don't. The people with power under current systems don't care about the people who do the work. They care about getting rich. So if there's an efficiency gain to be had, all of that new efficiency is going to be put towards increasing…

My employers who are introducing AI are not laughing evil supervillains hoovering up all the excess profits, they are normal people who wanted long careers and are as nervous as anyone about competition amd what AI will do to organizations if people become truly redundant.

Someone up in the food chain must have big investments in AI though. The great shove down didn't just appear.

Re: Can we have the day off?

#477

Post by pjmlp »

The C suit would rather that everyone takes all days off.

What they haven't yet explained is how everyone is supposed to earn money to buy AI produced goods.

Re: Can we have the day off?

#478

Post by kelnos »

jppope wrote: post #466

My Dad used to cover a territory in the Northeast where he was on the road for up to 2 weeks at a time. Sometimes we'd see him just long enough for him to grab a haircut and remember everyone's names in the right order. Everyday he showed up to work he needed to be in a full suit and tie. Everyone did. If those suits weren't in good shape, and you weren't on time they were probably picking a different guy for promoti…

Just because someone else has it worse, it doesn't mean we can't want for something better for ourselves.

And I personally would like that something better for the people who have it worse, too.

Re: Can we have the day off?

#479

Post by _doctor_love »

iteria wrote: post #338
quadrifoliate wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand why people make these hyperbolic jokes about guillotines. Violence is counterproductive; and not practical anyway. Joking about it just makes you feel great without actually doing anything. There is a simple alternative. Vote; and educate your family and friends. If you don't know what is on the ballot in the midterms, you are part of the problem. If you aren't starting a family conversation about…

Everyone talks about MLK, but no one points out that people were willing to listen because Malcom X was a looming threat if MLK failed. Yes vote, but the threat of violence is what makes voting a delighted option. That's why protests exist. They are reminders that peace is a choice. Violent revolution has merit when peaceful means break down. The rise of the guillotine jokes are the first time that people are losing…

> Violent revolution has merit when peaceful means break down.

Robespierre first entered the chat: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reign_of_Terror

Then Napoleon followed.

Make of it what you will.

[EDIT: for the downvoters - the folks who got guillotined in France were definitely bad, but the Terror was very real and very awful. It tends to be a trend with the noble overthrowers that after the initial wins they then get excited to go lop the heads off anyone else that might have ever bothered them. Be careful what you wish for.]

Re: Can we have the day off?

#480

Post by dalyons »

OneOffAsk wrote: post #330
fg137 wrote: post #296

I never understand why software engineers are so excited about AI as a whole. If you are excited about the technology, sure. But if you are excited about the increase in productivity, unless you are a manager, I don't really understand it. Like, why? You are not working one hour less than before. If anything, it's more likely you'll get laid off and have trouble finding your next job.

There’s a natural desire for people to want to make things. Most of the time it’s physical: homes, crafts, woodworking. But for a few of us it’s ok for it to be non physical. Actually, that’s part of the allure of programming: you don’t need much more than a computer and some thinking to build incredibly intricate… things. AI is like a brand new power tool. It’s fun to use because you can build faster. I felt a sense…

I think you’re missing the op’s point. Yes it’s fun but you don’t personally get any of the gains. Just more work
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