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Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

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Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#471

[flagged]

How to solve the increasing frequency of AI generated posts on HN

This website is under attack from relentless AI slop spam, both in submissions and in comments, and I have absolutely no idea what we can do about it. To me this stuff is an existential threat to a site like this.

I moderate a mid sized subreddit (few hundred thousand) and I ban AI spammers on sight with extreme prejudice, but I don't feel like that same attitude meshes well with HN.

Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#473

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a company with little other (any?) revenue you have to include all costs though. Data centers, power, hardware, salaries, marketing, etc. Not just training models and serving requests. I don’t see how it’s not subsidized substantially considering how much money they’re burning right now (I only base that on their rounds though).

That's not really how people discuss subsidies and finances though. Yea I guess a not-profitable company means that every operation is technically a "subsidy", but again, that's not really what those words mean. Anthropic (as the ever-chosen example) has explicitly stated they've made more money than they've spent on training when they sell/serve a particular model in the past. They said that the reason they're negat…

It is when you discuss financial health of a company, at least that’s what I picked up after doing fintech and loans, it’s the bottom line that matters, or the projected outcome of the same. What point is there making money in area A when area B costs more. If you can stop doing B without affecting A that’s usually what happens, but it’s not always possible.

Saying ”we’re positive except the foundation of the company (training models) isn’t” is a tell tale sign.

And I’m sure Anthropic is doing what most others are doing, heavily massaging numbers to make them look good for VC rounds.

Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#474

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Costco gets to sidestep a lot of regulations because they technically are a private club with paid membership. The US anti-monopoly laws are also unusually weak. In other countries, selling a $7 chicken if it's subsidized by the sale of other goods can indeed be illegal.

Do you have some countries in mind where that's illegal?

That would most likely be illegal in Finland. You're not allowed predatory pricing. And the same is true for the EU as a whole, although you may have to be operating in an international market, not just a local one. See Abuse of dominance in: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_102_of_the_Treaty_on_t...

Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#475
post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lmao no. You cannot use your common sim card for that. It's for an individual and they will cut your service and justifiably so, if they figure out that's what you're using it for. If you buy a sim card built for that purpose sure, but then you'll be paying...biz prices! This isn't really that hard to figure out people. So much outrage in comments on this. Self entitlement to the max from people who really haven't li…

So, if I use my SIM card 16 hours a day, 7 days a week, Ill get banned? Doesn’t that seem absurd? The SIM card is enforcing one voice call at a time. If the apartment building has to wait in line to use it, what’s the difference? If you deployed it in a way that did multiplexing such that multiple users could use it at once, then sure—-Business time. But otherwise…

> So, if I use my SIM card 16 hours a day, 7 days a week, Ill get banned?

Probably not - you'll get billed or hit a FUP

> Doesn’t that seem absurd? The SIM card is enforcing one voice call at a time. If the apartment building has to wait in line to use it, what’s the difference?

The difference is that it is perfectly acceptable to enforce a "no-reselling" or a "no-3rd-party" for services.

I can't think of a single service provider that provides a consumer tier permitting reselling or 3rd-party use.

Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#476
post #200

I'll admit to knowingly taking advantage of Google's pricing, but I had assumed it was within a gray area. No warning bans are insane.

Google has always done no warning bans YouTube is also full of huge content creators, people who make Google tons of money, that complain about the Byzantine and opaque rules they have to dance around to maintain their livelihood and fan base Google fears their giant userbases so they act with zero regard for communication and transparency because of the small chance it’d help the abusers

There was a recent gnarly version of this where some anime reactors and at least one animation channel (with something like 1.4 million subs) got demonetized and had to go through a ton of hoops to get a human to fix it.

Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#477

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To my understanding, OpenClaw pretends to be Antigravity by using the Antigravity OAuth client ID (and doesn't have its own), and then the takes the token Google returns to instead use with OpenClaw. When I first tried OpenClaw and chose Google Sign-In, I noticed the window appeared saying "Sign into Google Antigravity" with a Google official mark, and a warning it shouldn't be used to sign into anything besides offi…

Ah, ok. I guess there is no way for Google to prevent this since desktop apps are public clients that use PKCE. I imagine Open Claw must also have registered the Antigravity custom URL scheme in order to receive the redirect. Remaining question is how Google determines that traffic is not actually coming from Antigravity.

If this is like the flow it uses for a codex / ChatGPT subscription it doesn’t even register a handler - the redirect opens as a 404 in your browser and there are instructions in copying the token from the query string!

Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#478

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lmao no. You cannot use your common sim card for that. It's for an individual and they will cut your service and justifiably so, if they figure out that's what you're using it for. If you buy a sim card built for that purpose sure, but then you'll be paying...biz prices! This isn't really that hard to figure out people. So much outrage in comments on this. Self entitlement to the max from people who really haven't li…

I can do it pretty easily. The restriction in both cases is so easily overcome it is ridiculous to build your buisness model around it and disrespectful to the customer's intellect.

> The restriction in both cases is so easily overcome

And? Being able to easily bypass a providers rules does not make that rule invalid.

Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#479

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, the problem is that the discounted rate exists in the first place. Essentially these are unfair business practices, product cross subsidization to ensure market dominance. See also: Microsoft and a whole bunch of other companies. And once they've got their monopoly position there is inevitably the rug-pull. I wonder if some CPO somewhere actually had the guts to put a 'rug pull' item on the product roadmap.

So you are saying a company should never reinvest profits in the company to support another money losing business until it’s profitable? Should Netflix for instance not invested money from renting DVDs to invest in a streaming service? Apple not use the profits it was making from selling Apple //e’s to create the Mac?

Subsidizing the cost of developing a product isn't necessarily bad, but predatory pricing that prohibits competition would be.

Not sure that this case is either. This is just idiots breaking the TOS.

Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#480

[flagged]

It seems that this comment was written with some AI tool. Curious to know — are you an OpenClaw instance? Your profile seems to be an ad for some tool you or your owner/administrator created: > Building EvoLink ( https://evolink.ai ) - a unified AI API gateway for 40+ models. We help developers save 20-70% on AI API costs with smart routing and automatic failover. Previously worked on AI infrastructure and growth. Yo…

I can't imagine feeling entitled to shove AI outputs in everyone's face on a user forum. It's predatory. They know no one wants it but they want to make a quick buck.
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