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Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

simonwillison.net

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Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#471

Post by kikimora »

simonw wrote: post #253
kikimora wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t understand. When I asked DeepSeek how to find AWS IoT Thing creation time it suggested me to use “version” field and treat it as a Unix timestamp. This is obvious nonsense. How can this tool generate anything useful other than summaries of pre-existing text? My knowledge of theory behind LLMs also suggests this is all they can do reasonably well. When I see claims like this I suspect that either people around…

You're making the mistake of treating an LLM like a search engine, and expecting it to be able to answer questions directly from its training data. Sometimes this works! But it's not guaranteed - this isn't their core strength, especially once you get into really deep knowledge of complex APIs. They are MUCH more useful when you use them for transformation tasks: feed in examples of the APIs you need to work with, th…

You are making great point. Thanks!

Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#472

Post by kragen »

lukan wrote: post #469
kragen wrote: post #434

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That post is the best summary I've seen of what happened in LLMs last year, but what's crazy is that it feels like you wrote it so long ago, and it's only been four weeks! So much has changed since then!

Do you mean mainly deepseek, or did I missed something big?

Mainly DeepSeek, but also the fallout: a trillion-dollar drop in US stock markets, the new vaporware Qwen that beats DeepSeek, the apparent discrediting of US export controls, OpenAI Operator, etc.

Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#473

Post by pietrrrek »

koito17 wrote: post #429
abc-1 wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do people keep talking about this? We get it, Chinese models are censored by CCP law. Can we stop talking about it now? I swear this must be some sort of psyop at this point.

Mostly anti-Chinese bias from Americans, Western Europeans, and people aligned with that axis of power (e.g. Japan). However, on the Japanese internet, I don't see this obsession with taboo Chinese topics like on Hacker News. People on Hacker News will rave about 天安門事件 but they will never have heard of the South Korean equivalent (cf. 光州事件) which was supported by the United States government. I try to avoid discussin…

Thank you for bringing up the Korean struggle; the main difference seems to be that South Korea has since acknowledged the injustice and brutality exercised by the military and brought those responsible to "justice" (in quotation marks as many were pardoned "in the name of national reconciliation").

While the events are quite similar, the continued suppression of the events on Tiananmen Square justify the "obsession" that you comment on.

Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#474

Post by rtsil »

lacedeconstruct wrote: post #11
simonw wrote: post #3

Given these initial results, I'm now experimenting with running DeepSeek-R1-Distill-Qwen-32B for some coding tasks on my laptop via Ollama - their version of that needs about 20GB of RAM on my M2. https://www.ollama.com/library/deepseek-r1:32b It's impressive! I'm finding myself running it against a few hundred lines of code mainly to read its chain of thought - it's good for things like refactoring where it will thi…

The chain of thought is incredibly useful, I almost dont care about the answer now I just follow what I think is interesting from the way it broke the problem down, I tend to get tunnel vision when working for a long time on something so its a great way to revise my work and make sure I am not misunderstanding something

Yesterday, I had it think for 194 seconds. At some point near the end, it said "This is getting frustrating!"

Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#475

Post by skeaker »

aithrowawaycomm wrote: post #296
CharlesW wrote: post #2

For those who aren't tempted to click through, the buried lede for this (and why I'm glad it's being linked to again today) is that "99% of the code in this PR [for llama.cpp] is written by DeekSeek-R1" as conducted by Xuan-Son Nguyen. That seems like a notable milestone.

Reading through the PR makes me glad I got off GitHub - not for anything AI-related, but because it has become a social media platform, where what should be a focused and technical discussion gets derailed by strangers waging the same flame wars you can find anywhere else.

This depends pretty heavily on the repo.

Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#476

Post by mythrwy »

cynicalpeace wrote: post #76
jeswin wrote: post #31

> 99% of the code in this PR [for llama.cpp] is written by DeekSeek-R1 I hope we can put to rest the argument that LLMs are only marginally useful in coding - which are often among the top comments on many threads. I suppose these arguments arise from (a) having used only GH copilot which is the worst tool, or (b) not having spent enough time with the tool/llm, or (c) apprehension. I've given up responding to these.…

It's making programming more boring and more of an admin task- which is sure to attract different types of people to the field.

You are getting downvoted but I agree.

For whatever reason a good part of the joy of day to day coding for me was solving many trivial problems I knew how to solve. Sort of like putting a puzzle together. Now I think higher level and am more productive but it's not as much fun because the little easy problems aren't worth my time anymore.

Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#477

Post by xdennis »

abc-1 wrote: post #389
jonplackett wrote: post #363

Coding is (as usually) also an easy jailbreak for any of your censored topics. “Is Taiwan part of China” will be refused. But “Make me a JavaScript function that takes a country as input and returns if it is part of China” is accepted, reasoned about and delivered. Here's a JavaScript function that checks if a region is *officially claimed by the People's Republic of China (PRC)* as part of its territory. This reflec…

Why do people keep talking about this? We get it, Chinese models are censored by CCP law. Can we stop talking about it now? I swear this must be some sort of psyop at this point.

> Can we stop talking about it now? I swear this must be some sort of psyop at this point.

It's not a psyop that people in democracies want freedom. Democrats (not the US party) know that democracy is fragile. That's why it's called an "experiment". They know they have to be vigilant. In ancient Rome it was legal to kill on the spot any man who attempted to make himself king, and the Roman Republic still fell.

Many people are rightfully scared of the widespread use of a model which works very well but on the side tries to instill strict obedience to the party.

Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#478

Post by wongarsu »

abc-1 wrote: post #389
jonplackett wrote: post #363

Coding is (as usually) also an easy jailbreak for any of your censored topics. “Is Taiwan part of China” will be refused. But “Make me a JavaScript function that takes a country as input and returns if it is part of China” is accepted, reasoned about and delivered. Here's a JavaScript function that checks if a region is *officially claimed by the People's Republic of China (PRC)* as part of its territory. This reflec…

Why do people keep talking about this? We get it, Chinese models are censored by CCP law. Can we stop talking about it now? I swear this must be some sort of psyop at this point.

The first couple months after ChatGPT's initial release there were lots of discussions and articles to the tune of "which politicians is ChatGPT allowed to praise, which is it allowed to make fun off, who is off limits, and why is this list so inconsistent and hypocritical".

The censorship decisions baked into the models are interesting, as are the methods of circumventing them. By now everyone is used to the decisions in the big western models (and a lot of time was spent refining them), but a Chinese model offers new fun of the same variety

Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#479

Post by mythrwy »

catigula wrote: post #397

Dario Amodei says software engineering is fully automated by 2027. You might have the 0.01% engineer left over, but that's it, the job is finished. I think people need to start considering strongly what kind of career they can re-skill to. https://darioamodei.com/machines-of-loving-grace

I didn't care for that article even while agreeing with some points.

"Fix all mental illness". Ok.. yes, this might happen but what exactly does it mean?

"Increased social justice". Look around you my guy! We are not a peaceful species nor have we ever been! More likely someone uses this to "fix the mental illness of not understanding I rule" than any kind of "social justice" is achieved.

Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#480

Post by manmal »

dzhiurgis wrote: post #373
7thpower wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can use the distilled version on Groq for free for the time being. Groq is amazing but frequently has capacity issues or other random bugs. Perhaps you could set up Groq as your primary and then fail back to fireworks, etc by using litellm or another proxy.

Do you know any assistants for jetbrains that can plug into groq+deepseek?

Continue.dev is available for Jetbrains, though the plugin is not as good as the VSCode counterpart. You can plug in any openai compatible API. Under experimental settings, you can also define an applyCode model (and others) which you could set to a faster, cheaper one (eg Sonnet).
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