Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account • Hacker News Board

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#471

Post by tpmoney » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 1:55 AM UTC

freedomben wrote: post #434

burnerthrow008 wrote: post #390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is one of those things where there is only upside for everyone involved. Except all of us who value privacy and security. Face it: the major competition between app stores is not going to be on price, but a race to the bottom on who can allow apps to fuck over users the hardest.

You really think Apple is just going to abandon everything it believes in and trash their brand in a race to the bottom? If there's one company I don't expect that from, it's Apple. They may have highly dubious ethics but they are damn good at business and marketing, and I would be utterly shocked if they don't position themselves as the safe, privacy-friendly official app store. For people who don't enable side-load…

It's not whether Apple will, it's the other developers that you might not have a choice to interact with. Sure, in the tech space, we're all imagining the great open source on iOS revolution. Gamers are anticipating their Fortnite.

And I'm sure Facebook is anticipating not having to ask for permission to hoover up all your personal data. Sure you don't need facebook, but if you want to be using WhatsApp to communicate with your friends and family, you might not have a choice. Shady companies that sell shady spyware to schools "for the children" are looking forward to a much easier time rolling out the most invasive ideas they have. The ad companies are I'm sure salivating over telemetry libraries with extra detailed modes for non-Apple app store installations.

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#472

Post by xnyan » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 2:09 AM UTC

lenkite wrote: post #432

znpy wrote: post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Microsoft simply lacked the network effects Microsoft execs had their heads buried too deep in their own asses to be able to understand what was needed at the time. They pushed a platform (Windows phone) that lacked interesting features out of the box, lacked cloud services integration to fill the gap left by the lacking base features, and required Windows as a development platform (and, iirc, C# as well?). It didn…

Microsoft failed because they weren't persistent enough. When you are the third entry in the market, you need to stay on the race and improve. Windows phone was profitable - $3.8 billion in a quarter using Lumias. But Nadella wanted to make Microsoft a cloud services company and leave the OS behind, so he axed the Phone. Now, Apple is achieving per-eminance in the cross-device consumer OS market in the latop+tablet+s…

> Apple is achieving per-eminance in the cross-device consumer OS market in the latop+tablet+smartphone

Only in the US and global high-end market. This is an extremely profitable market to be leading and I'm not trying to minimize Apple's achievement, but globally relatively few people use their phones and tablets, and ever fewer use their traditional computers.

Apple has a sizable lead, but I think the "idea" of what a smartphone is has been locked in essentially in the mind of consumers and their technological lead will only last so long as time passes. They are Microsoft but of smartphones and 20 years younger than windows desktop PCs. They know this, which is why they constantly make new things and try to develop new products (vr headsets, etc).

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#473

Post by transitionnel » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 2:14 AM UTC

zmmmmm wrote: post #446

jfoster wrote: post #429

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Difficult to imagine what Apple were thinking in the first place. Did they actually think there was a chance the EU would let this slide? Best I can tell, all they've achieved is bringing even greater scrutiny on themselves.

When reason fails to explain people's actions, it gives you a measure of the strength of their ideology on something. In this case, you can see how deeply they believe in the concept of complete authoritarian control of their ecosystem. Enough that logic and practical outcomes barely matter in comparison.

Chaining one sole thought-logic all the waaaayyyyy...untiiiilllll zap

I think Apple may behave more creditably from here on out.

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#474

Post by tshaddox » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 2:19 AM UTC

ethbr1 wrote: post #424

tshaddox wrote: post #416

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree that there are plenty of ways competitors could differentiate themselves. But in the current market, I think there are very few competitors, and even fewer ways they currently differentiate themselves. And the most notable recent regulations would eliminate one of the more meaningful differentiations.

Differentiating on percent of app / subscription price taken by app store?

That’s not what I had in mind.

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#475

Post by fnordpiglet » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 2:19 AM UTC

snowpid wrote: post #234

fnordpiglet wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting. I thought housing in the EU has been a challenge for generations with home ownership a difficult to impossible goal for most people, with this being the case across the region. In the US the housing affordability issue is in a few highly desirable urban areas, but not being generally case across the country. I think the bread in the US, sans the supermarket stuff, is generally exceptional with bakeries t…

" But the reality of America is much more complex than that, and that’s accelerated since the 1950’s, and was completely broken down in the 1990’s. " You complain a lack of seing the complexity of American food but instead you have a simple view of the European cultures. Have you been ever in any European country and when? I have the feeling you havent been.

I’ve traveled through most of Europe and the UK for pleasure but also regularly visit Germany, Italy, France, Ireland, Scotland, England, and Switzerland for work.

If I go to your average Italian city I simply won’t find good Thai food. I’ll get a lot of great Italian food for sure. But no Malay, no Nepalese, no afghan, no Peruvian, etc. I’m sure you’ll find counter examples, but the US genuinely is a melting pot with well established ethnic subcultures of all cultures on earth and the general society is pretty open. There’s no French nationalism etc. The thing is there’s no established cultural monoculture like you find in most of the world - what people mistake for a lack of culture in America is that it’s a palimpsest of hundreds of cultures, and they all bring their foods to the American table.

This isn’t a knock on the modern multiculturalism in Europe, it’s more a statement that the established historic cultures in Europe squeeze out the diversity more than in the US with its lack of established historic culture that has almost entirely evaporated in the last 80 years.

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#476

Post by FuturisticGoo » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 2:20 AM UTC

nozzlegear wrote: post #342

8note wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a much better experience on windows to not be stuck with a windows store. Third party stores like steam are way better

Imagine if we had to download the Windows Store on iOS just to get Outlook, Word or Excel though. That's what the OP is predicting.

And yet that never happens on Android. All of the major players use Google play store because regular consumers aren't gonna install another app store just to use some apps.

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#477

Post by Drew_ » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 2:21 AM UTC

freedomben wrote: post #438

mulmen wrote: post #372

Apple believes this is an existential threat and they are fighting against it as hard as they can. But is this a self-fulfilling prophecy? These actions come with a cost. This gives Epic visibility and it harms trust in Apple’s brand. How do they balance these costs against the perceived threat?

Does it harm trust in Apple's brand? From what I can gather, people who already love and trust Apple want them to do this. They view the status quo as better, and would likely lose trust if Apple didn't fight this as much as possible.

> Does it harm trust in Apple's brand?

The government's trust, yes.

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#478

Post by mulmen » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 2:24 AM UTC

summerlight wrote: post #346

It feels like the initial ban decision was driven by some high level exec (probably Phil Schiller)? If it was happened to be reviewed carefully by lawyers and public relations, they cannot really ban Epic so quickly. There are too many uncertainties and if you do something wrong, that puts government relations at huge risk. Typical employees cannot be held accountable for such decisions, not even low tier VP.

If a VP is "low tier" then isn't calling them a VP at all just title inflation? At what point is a person responsible for the consequences of their actions regardless of intent?

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#479

Post by jncfhnb » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 2:24 AM UTC

usr1106 wrote: post #169

Vespasian wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True. I like the term "gatekeeper" the EU defines and uses. Combined with the "must be very big" requirement it better fits what is going on in the tech world.

Vendor lock-in is what wecall it in the IT-sector.

Not really. Gatekeeping is applied because you must pay Apple the tax to access its customers; not use its tech.

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#480

Post by nozzlegear » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 2:29 AM UTC

FuturisticGoo wrote: post #476

nozzlegear wrote: post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine if we had to download the Windows Store on iOS just to get Outlook, Word or Excel though. That's what the OP is predicting.

And yet that never happens on Android. All of the major players use Google play store because regular consumers aren't gonna install another app store just to use some apps.

Clearly Epic thinks they'll do it. Different ecosystem, who knows?