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The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

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Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#471

Post by r_hoods_ghost »

jedberg wrote: post #373
albntomat0 wrote: post #369

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But I would have had to work in their office in Manhattan, be in by 8:30am every day and not leave until after 5 at a miniumum. That’s what you said originally, which reads as mostly normal work hours, plus maybe some overtime. If it was 16 hours a day, then please say so.

Read the rest of the comment? > I wouldn't be allowed to take my laptop home, so if I had a hard problem to solve, I'd have to stay in the office the whole time. So basically they expected us to never see our family nor collaborate with anyone.

So go home when you get to 5.00. Think. Come back to office at 8.30. Work. That's what most people do.

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#472

Post by 4ggr0 »

poly_morphis wrote: post #398
interactivecode wrote: post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ll come hangout at the office for that much, no problemo.

Yeah, for that compensation? No question. I'd maybe try and stay a little while past 5. Not sure how many months (years?) I'd last there though, not knowing how 'intensive' the work culture is.

The comp he mentioned is almost 11x of what I make yearly. Of course I lack the skills for a c++ job, but if I worked there for a year I could go on a vacation for the next couple of years. insane.

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#474

Post by pavlov »

bombolo wrote: post #441
varispeed wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair all engineering positions are paid poorly if you compare to the profits corporations are making.

software companies often don't make any money at all.By that logic paying them at all is too much.

It’s the growth, not the profit. Software engineering is a lever for growth for businesses designed that way. If you can grow revenue by $100M by spending $10M on engineer salaries, it usually makes sense.

On the other hand companies with steady profits and little growth have no such expectations and try to pay as little as possible for the software engineers they do need.

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#475

Post by easytiger »

jedberg wrote: post #142

There are plenty of talented C++ programmers. They just don't want to be abused by trading firms or work in that culture. Even paying them more won't work, because no amount of money is worth that abuse. I interviewed at a trading firm once, while I was working at Netflix (because Netflix encouraged us to interview for outside jobs at least once a year). The comp would have been double my Netflix salary. But I would…

> There are plenty of talented C++ programmers. They just don't want to be abused by trading firms or work in that culture. Even paying them more won't work, because no amount of money is worth that abuse.

With all due respect you don't know what you are talking about. This doesn't represent my 15+ year experience in that domain.

> But I would have had to work in their office in Manhattan, be in by 8:30am every day and not leave until after 5 at a miniumum.

Must have been a back office job because that's not early enough for trading hours.

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#476

Post by raverbashing »

peteradio wrote: post #282
gary_0 wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "correct" way is also template-heavy so enjoy long compile times followed by utterly incomprehensible error messages.

You mean coffee breaks and job security are baked into the language?

If you call PTSD job security, sure

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#477

Post by roundandround »

jiggawatts wrote: post #458
jack_pp wrote: post #432

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how do you know for certain you'd be required to do overtime consistently? you've never worked in the field. I haven't either but I'm not assuming crazy stuff like being required to work 16h a day. your stance is completely unreasonable. There are other commenters who have worked in the field and said no one was expected to be in the office after normal working hours

Not to mention that programmers consistently doing 16 hour days would get exhausted and burnt out within a week , making their productivity plummet. No manager in their right mind would trust code from utterly exhausted people written after midnight to manage billions of dollars of capital.

I met a banking C++ engineer years ago who was the only one left locally and spent his time teaching C++ to fresh offshore engineers in the form of code reviews. He was kind of a manager, though also his manager was probably rational.

1. It makes no correction in how an irrational institution is run that first level managers are rational. It just means they are stressed.

2. I met him at a language meetup for another language, he wanted out but would have trouble making half his salary.

(If you wanted me to trust code written by interns and reviewed across distance and language barriers, C++ wouldn't be my first choice, assuming I got a job in banking management, how likely would it be that I could change anything about that?)

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#478

Post by gardenhedge »

jedberg wrote: post #292
jstx1 wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for sharing! The focus on paying top compensation is very different from anywhere I've worked.

I've never seen it anywhere else either! It was one of the many things I loved about working at Netflix.

I found this conversation pretty interesting. Where are working now if you don't mind sharing?

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#479

Post by randomNumber7 »

I'm very good in C++. If you offer enough $$$ i might work for you (prefereably remote).

But in all honesty. I would rather like a non C++ job, because i have ~30 years of work before me, and i don't want to end up like those dinosaur Cobol or C programmers today.

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#480

Post by Retric »

jiggawatts wrote: post #455
jedberg wrote: post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not rational at all. It shows a complete distrust for the employee. National security is different because the rules are imposed from the outside. These are self imposed rules. Also most defense contractor employees don't work that much overtime and many can take the non-classified parts of their work home.

Let me get this straight... you turned down a nearly seven-figure income because you would be required to not work at home and you were asked to stick to the same office hours as cubible farm workers making a tenth of that income? Umm... wat!?

Income has logarithmic value. His options were to make 350k and be happy day to day or make twice that and be in an activity hostile environment. Lifestyle wise there is little meaningful difference between 350k and 700k when you don’t have much free time to spend it.

Sure in theory he would be able to retire sooner etc, but retirement isn’t such a big deal if you don’t hate your job. Also, savings compounds so saving 3x as much doesn’t mean working 1/3 as long especially when you consider social security benefits etc.

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