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FCC: TikTok is unacceptable security risk and should be removed from app stores

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Re: FCC: TikTok is unacceptable security risk and should be removed from app stores

#471

Post by stevenjgarner »

blitz_skull wrote: post #333
blacklion wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I want USA to do whatever it needs to be the top player Are you sure? Several months ago I've woke up to learn, that my country start to kill civilians of other country with bombs, missiles and shelling, to become "top player". And, what is even worse, many of my fellow citizens support it. Now I'm trying to leave this country for some other, which don't have ambitions to be top-player but don't kill civilians and…

This comment seems in bad faith. I think it’s pretty clear this conversation wasn’t about killing civilians so the comment about “whatever necessary” probably wasn’t intended to include violations of the Geneva convention. Just saying.

Personally I find it rewarding how the accuracy of language matters here on HN. Initially when someone voted down one of my comments I was all butt-hurt. Then I got to realizing how justified the down-vote was as I was being lazy with my use of language - I was not actually saying what I really meant. Slowly it helped me think first then write what I actually meant. Still not perfect, but so much more intentional. After all, many of us here on HN are coders of one sort or another, where the accuracy of (computer) language is all too important. It should matter no less how accurately we talk with one another?

Re: FCC: TikTok is unacceptable security risk and should be removed from app stores

#472

Post by sudosysgen »

cowtools wrote: post #107
jmfayard wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US government is a foreign government for 96% of the people, not to mention that its own citizens don't control it much.

The USA is a democracy. Arguing otherwise is the pot calling the kettle black.

I don't see how an Iraqi should care that the US is a democracy, really.

Re: FCC: TikTok is unacceptable security risk and should be removed from app stores

#473

Post by SXX »

brimstedt wrote: post #391
blacklion wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I want USA to do whatever it needs to be the top player Are you sure? Several months ago I've woke up to learn, that my country start to kill civilians of other country with bombs, missiles and shelling, to become "top player". And, what is even worse, many of my fellow citizens support it. Now I'm trying to leave this country for some other, which don't have ambitions to be top-player but don't kill civilians and…

Easy to say, I know, but people like you should not leave. You should stay and make a change.

How is he suppose to make a change? Go to prison? Is your country actively provide asylum for non-celebrities Russian political immigrants and their families?

When Putin captured all the power in the country, rigged the elections, killed journalists no one cared at all. US, EU, UK, etc - no reaction at all. War with Georgia - no reaction.

When Russia actually started this war 8 years ago and annexed Crimea there been really weak reaction and after everyone just did business as usual. EU even sold Kremlin equipment to fight protesters as well as military weapons on condition they will only be used "inside the country".

When Russian opposition leader Navalny was poisoned again no real sanctions were introduced. Now US, EU and UK expect people to go on streets and protest.

PS: I am from Russia and I immigrated to Turkey on 25th of February and there is nothing fun about going into unplanned political immigration. I dont try to remove all responsibility from myself or someone else, but even I as software engineer have very limited capacity to do political activity. Since I have a job and my family to feed.

Now from abroad I help my friends from Ukraine when I can and I publicly share my political statementa that will land me to prison if I ever come back. But sorry I'm not going to destroy my life for the cause.

Re: FCC: TikTok is unacceptable security risk and should be removed from app stores

#474

Post by tablespoon »

snehk wrote: post #10

I don't have a horse in this race at all, but the annoying part is that the same rules don't get applied across the board. Everything they're accusing TikTok of - from data harvesting to the government having access to said data - is true for western companies as well and that should be the problem. Not the fact that the data is now in the hands of the Chinese but that the data is being collected at all provided to t…

> The problem should be that the data is collected and provided to the government whenever they want - not that it's not the Chinese government. We had this discussion after the Snowden leaks and nothing changed whatsoever. Back then it was the US government and the US gov had the chance to change the rules so this could not happen. Now they're up in arms because other governments do the exact same thing. It's really annoying.

The differentiator here is national security, which raises an entirely different set of issues than the typical data collection and user privacy ones.

It's like the difference between sharing your bank password with your wife vs. some dude you aren't very friendly with who has a history of wire fraud. "Treat everyone the same" is not a workable policy.

Re: FCC: TikTok is unacceptable security risk and should be removed from app stores

#475

Post by danenania »

PhantomBKB wrote: post #370
danenania wrote: post #302

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While any school shooting is a tragedy (and imo we do clearly need stronger gun control in the US), they are extremely rare statistically. https://www.city-journal.org/school-shootings-horrific-but-s... “the annual odds that an American child will die in a mass shooting at school are nearly 10 million to 1, about the odds of being killed by lightning or of dying in an earthquake”

There's clearly a strong opposition against gun control in US, so the fact that the media is downplaying the shootouts by comparing it to natural disasters is not surprising. But keep in mind, while Americans find it to be a commonality, it's rare to see news like this in other parts of the world: "...but students don’t need the active-shooter drills now conducted in over 95 percent of the nation’s schools..." Active…

Reporting the actual data is not "downplaying". And the notion that the US media downplays school shootings is about as wrong as you could possibly be. Have you ever watched US news? School shootings get 24/7 coverage for weeks.

"Active shooter drills? In schools? You folk live in a first world country but act like you are living in an active warzone"

These things happen due to the same kind of fear mongering and statistical illiteracy you demonstrate in your comments. School shootings are horrible, but extremely rare. It would, of course, be better if we didn't have them, just like it would be better if we didn't have earthquakes, electrical storms, plane crashes, etc. but it's not rational to make life choices based on 1 in 10 million events.

You're also wrong about support for gun control. A majority of the US population supports stronger gun control. Unfortunately, in our political system, that's not sufficient to make it happen.

Re: FCC: TikTok is unacceptable security risk and should be removed from app stores

#476

Post by sudosysgen »

jmyeet wrote: post #359

As much as the US government does questionable and bad things (and it does), the CCP is worse. The US still has at least the semblance of the rule of law. There is still some separation between corporations and the government. Corporations in China are extensions of the state and tools of foreign policy in a way they just aren't in the West. The US government can also be replaced. That's why China and the US just are…

The US has no rule of law for national security consideration in other countries. As a non US citizen the US government in practice has no due process consideration if they wish to spy on you, torture you, or kill you.

Corporations are an extension of the state in this process, as we have learned thanks to Edward Snowden. They have no choice but to facilitate the use of state power on foreign nationals.

As a non-American I don't see the difference for me. If you are an American all you're saying is "only my government should spy on me".

Re: FCC: TikTok is unacceptable security risk and should be removed from app stores

#477

Post by unilynx »

milchek wrote: post #295
ChrisLomont wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The USA ranks 26th for median wealth Wealth is also a function of age - older people tend to have more - and that ranking is not normalized by such extraneous factors. The US is number 2 by median income, and number 1 for median disposable income, both of which are pretty important, especially to younger people that want cash flow to enjoy life.

Out of curiosity, where did you get these numbers from? I’m not from the US, but what I do read and see on the internet is that people in the US also have a lot of debt (education, medical, and of course credit) I’m surprised that even for median disposable the US is number 1. But then again, maybe it’s a case of the internet being drowned out by a vocal minority?

Building up debt seems a good way to increase disposable income, at least in the short run.

Re: FCC: TikTok is unacceptable security risk and should be removed from app stores

#478

Post by iosjunkie »

rightbyte wrote: post #423
Cederfjard wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This comment doesn't seem to understand what the parent was saying or engage with their argument at all? 1. No it's not fine that American companies are threats to privacy and so on, and it should be dealt with. 2. However TikTok is a special case in that in addition to the above, it presents a national security risk (to the Americans), so it's reasonable to treat it differently and with more urgency.

> it presents a national security risk (to the Americans) In what way. Surely there is a shutdown button to press if TikTok go rouge. Dissidents should rather use the social networks the gov. or establishment wants to ban than the one they control (e.g. FB).

I would assume the fear is the PRC is gaining troves of data on individuals interests including politically divisive issues. This insight could lead to undue influence on the American population during elections or times of war.

Re: FCC: TikTok is unacceptable security risk and should be removed from app stores

#479

Post by revscat »

cowtools wrote: post #107
jmfayard wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US government is a foreign government for 96% of the people, not to mention that its own citizens don't control it much.

The USA is a democracy. Arguing otherwise is the pot calling the kettle black.

[flagged]

Re: FCC: TikTok is unacceptable security risk and should be removed from app stores

#480

Post by coliveira »

Msw242 wrote: post #378
bilbo0s wrote: post #369

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No top player. And many top players. MAD, as insane as it may sound, actually works. Everyone being fearful of massive retaliatory strikes keeps everyone in line. You get all sorts of bad behavior when nations have no fear of massive retaliatory strikes.

The world map has been mostly frozen the last few decades precisely because USA is the global hegemon and world police. Regional powers (which is what we would devolve to) are demonstrating exactly what the world would look like without America running the show: conquest and genocide in Ukraine, saber rattling in the south china sea, genocide of the Kurds. We don't have an interest in solving for all the world's ills…

If you think the world is stable as a result of the US, you should think again. It is exactly the contrary. The US itself is involved in wars since basically its foundation. The reason you say this is because you probably live in the US or one of its rich close alies. Everyone else will tell you that life under US hegemony means constant wars, coups, and political instability.
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