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Illinois Is the First State to Have High Schools Teach News Literacy

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Re: Illinois Is the First State to Have High Schools Teach News Literacy

#471

Post by rayiner »

tptacek wrote: post #448
rayiner wrote: post #354

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Go back and compare CNN reporting from today to the 1980s. And even the straight news is extremely partisan in story selection: compare the coverage of De Santis to Cuomo in 2020.[1] Plus, fully half the content on CNN (and 80% on MSNBC) is opinion. I’m not a partisan. I spent most of my life as a registered Democrat and read the NYT every day as recently as 2012-2013. But wokeness has definitely taken over and the p…

You had me until the "wokeness" stuff. I don't think we have to have the culture war to critique structural problems in cable news; these are attention-driven ad-sales businesses, and they're competing with each other to drive to extremes. As you point out, thankfully, cable news has less control over day-to-day politics than the impression you'd get from... cable news. On the ground, it's mostly Kiwanis Republicans…

Wokeness is relevant because of the aversion to doing things that are seen as compromising with systemic racism . Wokeness is uniquely willing to compromise traditional professional ethics in service of perceived higher morality. In journalism it manifests as abandoning the appearance of impartiality. E.g. the “do we call Trump racist” debate at the NYT.

As an aside, in the legal profession, it’s probably the most monumental shift in legal ethics in centuries. E.g. proposed rule 8.5 which thankfully was voted down: https://reason.com/volokh/2020/01/06/a-new-aba-model-rule-8-.... I’ve heard internal gossip from the ACLU and similar organizations where younger lawyers are rebelling against representing longstanding clients for social justice reasons. It’s really quite remarkable.

Re: Illinois Is the First State to Have High Schools Teach News Literacy

#472

Post by throwawayswede »

haswell wrote: post #431
throwawayswede wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Using 2016 as an example doesn’t invalidate that goal or imply bias. It actually does: > Republicans' trust has not recovered since then, while Democrats' has risen sharply. In fact, Democrats' trust over the past four years has been among the highest Gallup has measured for any party in the past two decades. This year, the result is a record 63-percentage-point gap in trust among the political party groups. https:…

You stated that it implies bias without articulating why you believe the bias exists. Will you elaborate on how you feel the quote you included implies bias?

From that report I just wanted to show that shortly before the 2020 election, the Gallup poll showed that confidence in the mass media has continued to decline among Republicans and independent voters, to 10% and 36%, respectively. Among Democratic voters, confidence rose to 73%.

Then you have other other polls from Gallup, like this one showing that six in 10 in US see partisan bias in news media. From the report:

> Americans Believe News Media Favors Democrats

Gallup asked those who perceive political bias in the news media to say which party the news media favors. Almost two-thirds (64%) of those who believe the media favors a political party say it is the Democratic Party. Only about a third as many (22%) believe the media favors Republicans.

> This is not new. Americans who perceive media bias have always said the direction of that bias leaned in favor of the Democrats, although the percentage holding that view has varied. The gap was smaller in 2003 and 1995, but was more similar to today's attitudes in 2000.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/207794/six-partisan-bias-news-m...

Re: Illinois Is the First State to Have High Schools Teach News Literacy

#473

Post by jahaja »

rayiner wrote: post #354
wolverine876 wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But the landscape has become a lot more partisan/ideological in the last 10 years, particularly at universities, so I understand why people are skeptical/concerned. What if the propagandists are portraying it that way, in order to create that skepticism/concern. They do delegitimize one institution after another: Journalism, education, government, etc. - these are the big ones. > so much unabashedly propagandist co…

Go back and compare CNN reporting from today to the 1980s. And even the straight news is extremely partisan in story selection: compare the coverage of De Santis to Cuomo in 2020.[1] Plus, fully half the content on CNN (and 80% on MSNBC) is opinion. I’m not a partisan. I spent most of my life as a registered Democrat and read the NYT every day as recently as 2012-2013. But wokeness has definitely taken over and the p…

> I spent most of my life as a registered Democrat

You just can't stop spinning can you? Your entire HN history is of reactionary stuff, yet you keep peddling shit like that to pretend that you haven't radicalized yourself along with the other conservatives. But then ofc the "wokeness" talk spills the beans.

Re: Illinois Is the First State to Have High Schools Teach News Literacy

#474

Post by [deleted] »

rayiner wrote: post #354
wolverine876 wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But the landscape has become a lot more partisan/ideological in the last 10 years, particularly at universities, so I understand why people are skeptical/concerned. What if the propagandists are portraying it that way, in order to create that skepticism/concern. They do delegitimize one institution after another: Journalism, education, government, etc. - these are the big ones. > so much unabashedly propagandist co…

Go back and compare CNN reporting from today to the 1980s. And even the straight news is extremely partisan in story selection: compare the coverage of De Santis to Cuomo in 2020.[1] Plus, fully half the content on CNN (and 80% on MSNBC) is opinion. I’m not a partisan. I spent most of my life as a registered Democrat and read the NYT every day as recently as 2012-2013. But wokeness has definitely taken over and the p…

[deleted]

Re: Illinois Is the First State to Have High Schools Teach News Literacy

#475

Post by beaner »

kesselvon wrote: post #352
beaner wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno, I went to college. I've seen what it's like on the inside. Before I ever had political opinions it was pretty easy to see that people came out kind of brainless and all thinking the same things. It did not seem like an institution that really developed peoples' ability to think for themselves.

What you get out of college is entirely up to you.

Sure. This is my observation of the student body.

Re: Illinois Is the First State to Have High Schools Teach News Literacy

#476

Post by throwaway894345 »

unclebucknasty wrote: post #434
Tarsul wrote: post #419

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and that's why nowadays I'm very happy to being coerced to pay 20 Euros/month for the German public broadcasting, which doesn't have the incentive to make money but rather to inform and raise questions. There have been quite a few articles in the Atlantic and The Guardian that basically said that these public broadcasters are helping to guide the public, so that these total culture wars are somewhat weakened in count…

Our public broadcasting here in the U.S. is another casualty of the culture war, as it is accused of having a liberal bias. Bias exists in media to be sure, but one "side" in this country is completely off the rails; assaults truth, trafficks in conspiracy theories, and has generally adopted the fomenting of distrust, fear, hate and anger as its MO in its efforts to accumulate power. Any effort to counter their disin…

> Our public broadcasting here in the U.S. is another casualty of the culture war, as it is accused of having a liberal bias.

I’m a liberal American, and our public broadcasting (NPR and PBS) absolutely do have a liberal bias. It’s not as extreme as some outlets, but it’s certainly left-of-center (relative to the US political spectrum).

> Bias exists in media to be sure, but one "side" in this country is completely off the rails; assaults truth, trafficks in conspiracy theories, and has generally adopted the fomenting of distrust, fear, hate and anger as its MO in its efforts to accumulate power.

I agree with this as a statement of fact (though I frame it as an epistemological crisis brought on by the aggressive politicization of left-dominated institutions) but I really hate how my side uses it as an excuse to backslide. “We only have to be a little bit better than the other side, no need to move forward, blame everything on the Republicans no matter how tenuous.” This sort of race-to-the-bottom thinking is exactly what is wrong with American politics. The Republican side is broken and the Democrats will deflect any constructive criticism by pointing at the Republicans (and similarly progressives/liberals deflect to conservatives). We have to destroy the Republicans before we can consider improving/restoring ourselves.

Re: Illinois Is the First State to Have High Schools Teach News Literacy

#477

Post by nate_meurer »

rayiner wrote: post #471
tptacek wrote: post #448

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You had me until the "wokeness" stuff. I don't think we have to have the culture war to critique structural problems in cable news; these are attention-driven ad-sales businesses, and they're competing with each other to drive to extremes. As you point out, thankfully, cable news has less control over day-to-day politics than the impression you'd get from... cable news. On the ground, it's mostly Kiwanis Republicans…

Wokeness is relevant because of the aversion to doing things that are seen as compromising with systemic racism . Wokeness is uniquely willing to compromise traditional professional ethics in service of perceived higher morality. In journalism it manifests as abandoning the appearance of impartiality. E.g. the “do we call Trump racist” debate at the NYT. As an aside, in the legal profession, it’s probably the most mo…

It's a lot more than gossip. Ira Glasser (founder of the ACLU for those who are not rayiner) says the organization is at risk of losing its way for exactly this reason:

https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/02/14/the-aclu-would-not-...

Re: Illinois Is the First State to Have High Schools Teach News Literacy

#478

Post by tptacek »

nate_meurer wrote: post #477
rayiner wrote: post #471

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wokeness is relevant because of the aversion to doing things that are seen as compromising with systemic racism . Wokeness is uniquely willing to compromise traditional professional ethics in service of perceived higher morality. In journalism it manifests as abandoning the appearance of impartiality. E.g. the “do we call Trump racist” debate at the NYT. As an aside, in the legal profession, it’s probably the most mo…

It's a lot more than gossip. Ira Glasser (founder of the ACLU for those who are not rayiner) says the organization is at risk of losing its way for exactly this reason: https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/02/14/the-aclu-would-not-...

Ira Glasser wasn't even alive when the ACLU was founded.

Re: Illinois Is the First State to Have High Schools Teach News Literacy

#479

Post by nate_meurer »

tptacek wrote: post #478
nate_meurer wrote: post #477

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a lot more than gossip. Ira Glasser (founder of the ACLU for those who are not rayiner) says the organization is at risk of losing its way for exactly this reason: https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/02/14/the-aclu-would-not-...

Ira Glasser wasn't even alive when the ACLU was founded.

Shit. My reading comprehension sometimes...

Well, that guy did say that, whoever he is.

Re: Illinois Is the First State to Have High Schools Teach News Literacy

#480

Post by [deleted] »

throwaway894345 wrote: post #400
wolverine876 wrote: post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In "The Coddling of the American Mind" they cite studies showing that universities are more left-leaning than they've ever been. What do they mean by 'left-leaning'?: My professors might have been left-leaning, but I rarely knew their politics. The question is what the students are learning. Also, conservatives have moved far rightward, which might make others relatively more leftish. Also, reactionaries politicize…

> Also, conservatives have moved far rightward, which might make others relatively more leftish. I don't think this is true, I think the left-wing media has fixated increasingly on the far-right or exaggerating the extent to which individuals on the right are "far-right" which gives the impression that the right is drifting, but it's just the media changing how it represents the right. To be clear, the right is chang…

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