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Reviews of Android TV launcher after Google added ads to the homescreen

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Re: Reviews of Android TV launcher after Google added ads to the homescreen

#471
post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was one startup that I met a few years ago that focused on enabling IoT on 'dumb' devices. Their first product some sort of plug for ceiling fans that allowed people to turn on & off / control the ceiling fan with their smartphone. The product also required a $5/month subscription service. I remember asking the CEO why would someone pay $5/month just to control their fan and he basically responded that the idea…

I think you're overestimating the degree to which useless subscriptions are sustainable. I just moved and am about to purchase something identical to what you're describing[1], and it's a one-time purchase, as expected. [1] https://sensibo.com/?device=m&campaignID=12697870451

If it has a cloud dependency, you can be confident that the system it controls will probably outlive the service's free lifetime.

If you're willing to do some technical work, there is fantastic open source tooling in this space. Then you'll have a setup that isn't affected by the business desires or financial problems of others. As a bonus, you get better latency over lan.

https://tasmota.github.io/docs/Tasmota-IR/#sending-irhvac-co...

Re: Reviews of Android TV launcher after Google added ads to the homescreen

#472
post #425

I hate to be that guy, but this is exactly why I happily paid for an Apple TV. Yes, it’s $100 more than basic streaming sticks, but I have never had to worry about ads suddenly appearing after an update. This whole space is a race to the bottom with sticks being sold at or below cost because you are the product. For example, Vizio revealing in their first quarterly report as a public company that they get nearly as m…

I love my Apple TV but the Shield is my go to player simply for the audio passthrough of audio formats such as TrueHD and DTS-HD which last time I checked are not supported by the Apple TV!

Yea I have Apple everything except for this one Shield Pro because the audio quality (esp Atmos) is clearly better than AppleTV. Even my wife who really doesn’t care about audio notices.

Re: Reviews of Android TV launcher after Google added ads to the homescreen

#473
post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately Apple TV remotes are a nightmare to use. The touch UX is an absolute pain.

The new one is great - your complaint is an old one.

Yep. But can we expect everyone to spend $$$ to upgrade their Apple TV boxes for this or can we be allowed to complain a little when we bought the old device for Christmas last year?

PS: I don't actually complain :-) I'm a recent convert and compared to Chromecast I find Apple TV a massive upgrade.

Re: Reviews of Android TV launcher after Google added ads to the homescreen

#474

The one thing I like about Google's now many-years obsolete "do no evil" slogan is that it shows how it is impossible for companies to not eventually become "evil" once that's their only open easy revenue stream. Without debating what "evil" really means in this context, in the early days of a company there are plenty of ways to grow without being actively user hostile. Once those avenues are thoroughly maxed out, an…

Another one of Google’s tenets that have been forgotten is focus on the user. First it meant just focus on the user, then it became well we are focusing on the user when we do deceptive ads because then they get other services for free, then it was completely forgotten. I think there was a time when Apple was screwing up for a while and just making things shittier with new releases that Android actually was better. T…

> Edit: the iPhone keyboard really hates swearing though.

Lack of 3rd party keyboards was one of the things that kept me from using iPhones for a long time but these days I wonder why do anyone keep the original one?

Re: Reviews of Android TV launcher after Google added ads to the homescreen

#475
post #29

If history has taught us anything: this will blow over in a few weeks or months and everyone will get used to it in the end. The small percentage of users who (sometimes only temporarily) stop using the service is offset by the new income and the majority of users do not care.

If history taught us anything it’s that people will move to less friction platform. I was long time Google, but over the last few years I’ve almost migrated completely to Apple. I know a lot of developers in my field (video games) that have done the same. Google is using its size and reach to fill my products with ads. I’m not an ad id and I want to be treated as such. Also, why is android such a bad development plat…

Same here, although my reasons were a bit more mixed.

My wife and I went from flagship Android phones (latest and greatest Samsung or Sonys) to mid-range iPhones (XR) over the last few years and it feels like a massive improvement.

I'm not going back anytime soon and next week two more of my kids are getting (refurbished) iPhone 8 to replace their aging Samsung Galaxy S7 and Huawei .

Re: Reviews of Android TV launcher after Google added ads to the homescreen

#476

I hate to be that guy, but this is exactly why I happily paid for an Apple TV. Yes, it’s $100 more than basic streaming sticks, but I have never had to worry about ads suddenly appearing after an update. This whole space is a race to the bottom with sticks being sold at or below cost because you are the product. For example, Vizio revealing in their first quarterly report as a public company that they get nearly as m…

A correction - the article says Visio makes almost as much profits on ads and data ($38M) as hardware ($48M). In my view, the surprising thing here is how little money the hardware business makes. TVs are a low-margin product, so the revenues there are certainly higher. Visio sold 7 million TVs last year, and TVs last some years, so I’d estimate they have an install base of tens of millions and are making about $1 pe…

You can't really compare headline profits without seeing the full breakdown of revenue and expenses that led to those results.

For example Visio's hardware side could be reinvesting vast sums of revenue back into TV R&D. Or they could have invested in upstream component manufacturers. Maybe they spent a large amount on recruiting new staff. All those expenses are deducted before profit.

Meanwhile the ad division might have made no investments for the future and took the tax-inefficient choice to show a large profit instead.

Re: Reviews of Android TV launcher after Google added ads to the homescreen

#477

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does it support Full HD (at least) streaming from Netfilx and / or Prime? My setup is like GP's, ie I play the videos on the computer, but what bothers me personally is that I have to boot windows to get the high quality streaming. I've looked specifically at Kodi maybe a year ago and it didn't seem to support this. I'm OK with tinkering if I know it's actually possible to get this working.

The only service I subscribe to is njalla VPN, which I can then use to download any movie or TV show I want, in whatever quality I want and I get to keep it for as long as I want... can't get any smoother than that.

I'm not that big of a movie / tv show fan, I mostly watch while eating or when winding down for the day, so I rarely look for something specific. I'm very happy with Prime Video's offer, which is basically free for me, since I had already subscribed to Amazon Prime for regular shopping.

For my use, this is much less friction than any searching and waiting around for torrents or whatever to download.

There's also the discoverability factor. Not following current movies / shows, I don't necessarily know what shows exist. So browsing through random lists and then checking if they're available to download from enough people that it won't take a week is way too much work when all I want is to mindlessly watch something right now.

Re: Reviews of Android TV launcher after Google added ads to the homescreen

#478
post #143
post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's nothing wrong with it, if you are told about this up front and it's part of your purchasing calculation. Retroactively adding ads to an ad-free device after the customer has purchased it, sometimes buying it specifically to avoid competing devices with ads, is inexcusable bullshit.

If you subscribe to cable/satellite television, you expect there to be advertising. I'm not certain, but i suspect the agreement you sign while signing up for cable or streaming services, would include some sort of advertising clause. Ie, u less a service explicitly promotes am ad-free experience, there should be no expectations of such.

"If you subscribe to cable/satellite television, you expect there to be advertising."

WTF, NO YOU DON'T. You SUBSCRIBE, meaning you PAY for it. That means NO ADS. Subscriber-supported and ad-supported are SEPARATE, unless you're a spineless twat who's willing to PAY to watch ADS.

Re: Reviews of Android TV launcher after Google added ads to the homescreen

#479
Some years back, Google's then CEO Eric Schmidt openly stated that "The Google policy on a lot of things is to get right up to the creepy line and not cross it."[1]

It is also (as has been the case with numerous other tech firms) been to take other experiences, here maximal ad saturation, straight up to the pain tolerance, before (one presumes) dialing it down a bit.

(Facebook have similarly done this repeatedly with surveillance, stalking, and dark patterns, Microsoft formerly did this with licensing fee and process requirements, the latter limited by the tendency to drive users to either piracy or, vastly worse in Microsoft's view,[2] Linux or Free Software alternatives.)

The rationale is effectively the same as that captured by Jules Dupuit's 19th century observation on the miserable quality of third-class rail service:

It is not because of the several thousand francs which they would have to spend to cover the third class wagons or to upholster the benches. ... [I]t would happily sacrifice this [expense] for the sake of its popularity.

Its goal is to stop the traveler who can pay for the second class trip from going third class. It hurts the poor not because it wants them to personally suffer, but to scare the rich."[3]

My presumption is that Google are looking to pry those people who can afford a new (and presumably less-ad-saturated) device or (more likely) service off Android TV and onto their alternative offerings. I'm hoping this backfires via defections to other vendors, outright abandonment, and/or regulatory sanction. Though my expectations for all of these responses are low based on prior experience.

________________________________

Notes:

1. https://www.huffpost.com/entry/eric-schmidt-google-creepy_n_... (2010-10-4)

2. Bill Gates in 1998: "[A]s long as they’re going to steal it, we want them to steal ours. They’ll get sort of addicted, and then we’ll somehow figure out how to collect sometime in the next decade." https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2006-apr-09-fi-micro... (2009-4-6) See also Jeff Raikes "If they're going to pirate somebody, we want it ti be us rather than somebody else" https://www.informationweek.com/if-youre-going-to-steal-soft... (2007-3-12)

3. I don't have the original 1849 source, though this particular translation appears in a now-purged Inc. post by Bill Murphy Jr.: https://web.archive.org/web/20180307183620/https://www.inc.c... Based on dates and Dupuit's publication listing, this is probably found in De l’influence des peages sur 1’utilité des voies de communication.

Re: Reviews of Android TV launcher after Google added ads to the homescreen

#480

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're overestimating the degree to which useless subscriptions are sustainable. I just moved and am about to purchase something identical to what you're describing[1], and it's a one-time purchase, as expected. [1] https://sensibo.com/?device=m&campaignID=12697870451

If it has a cloud dependency, you can be confident that the system it controls will probably outlive the service's free lifetime. If you're willing to do some technical work, there is fantastic open source tooling in this space. Then you'll have a setup that isn't affected by the business desires or financial problems of others. As a bonus, you get better latency over lan. https://tasmota.github.io/docs/Tasmota-IR/#s…

Oh agreed, I haven't yet purchased the unit because it's on my todo list to look into options that don't have external deps. Historically, I have a strong preference for removing unnecessary servers in favor of using dynamic DNS with a device on my home network.

My only point was that even this server-based system is already selling without a subscription, and as you point out, the off-ramp to a system with no cloud dependency is pretty clear for those who want to avoid subscriptions (or dependencies in general).

Thanks for the pointer!

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