Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip • Hacker News Board

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#471

Post by cm2187 » Wed, May 19, 2021, 5:09 PM UTC

jmacd wrote: post #11

As an outside observer, who has no crypto holdings at all, but is very deeply invested in the public stock market with a heavy weight on technology stocks... this doesn't look like a crash to me at all. It just looks like some steam being let off and old investors cash out and new investors get more comfortable with how much and where to invest. I consider crypto currency as it is to be an elaborate Ponzi scheme (per…

As far as I can tell, the Fed is still pumping cash, so I agree that it's unlikely we see a large stock selloff.

https://www.federalreserve.gov/monetarypolicy/bst_recenttren...

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#472

Post by Animats » Wed, May 19, 2021, 5:09 PM UTC

vmception wrote: post #358

pradn wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't seem like anyone believes cryptos are supposed to be currencies any more. All the talk around them is around them being a new, exciting, and potentially very lucrative investment class. If you go to Coinbase's front page, you see that you can buy and sell them, like you can with Robinhood. It's not trying to be a PayPal. The currency-ness does serve an important purpose. It helps bring in investment for th…

USDC, DAI, USDT are all used more than ever, orders of magnitude more People dont have to talk about them as currencies because they just work No different than cellular reception in an underground subway, you dont have to think about it anymore

USDT is a concern, because it probably can't survive a big net outflow. Right now, dumping Bitcoin and buying, say, yuan is something a hedge fund might do. Or may have been doing over the last few weeks. What happens when some trader cashes out a few billion dollars in USDT to buy yuan? Coinbase has to wire transfer out that cash.

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#473

Post by vmception » Wed, May 19, 2021, 5:09 PM UTC

cableshaft wrote: post #364

vmception wrote: post #358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

USDC, DAI, USDT are all used more than ever, orders of magnitude more People dont have to talk about them as currencies because they just work No different than cellular reception in an underground subway, you dont have to think about it anymore

Yep, used USDC just last night to buy a new computer, just before this big crash happened, thankfully (since I converted some crypto to do it). Actually using that for its intended purpose.

No didn't you read all the other comments, that didn't happen because nobody uses them as currencies, or it didnt happen because either the payment processor, merchant, or their daycare provider eventually converted to the state’s local fiat currency so your experience is invalid /s

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#474

Post by imtringued » Wed, May 19, 2021, 5:10 PM UTC

jakeva wrote: post #427

imtringued wrote: post #377

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>When the price crashes money disappears. Thought experiment. I buy 1 BTC and pay you $50k. The current market price is $35k. Where did the $15k go?

That depends, doesn't it? Where did I get that BTC? Did I mine it in 2010, or did I buy it last month for $64k?

Maybe I wasn't clear enough.

What I really mean is that we sit down in the same room. You bought the BTC for $1 in 2013. Today I give you $50k in $100 dollar bills, you send me your 1 Bitcoin. I am deliberately ignoring the current exchange rate to prove a point. What happened is that I overpaid by $15k, I immediately lost $15k on this transaction. You got a bargain and gained $15k on top of the $35k you would have gotten from simply holding onto your Bitcoin in this transaction.

jasonlaramburu says "When the price crashes money disappears." but there are still 500 $100 dollar bills in the room. The price "crashed" by $15k the moment I purchased the BTC but the money I gave you didn't disappear, it just changed hands in a very unfair manner.

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#475

Post by koonsolo » Wed, May 19, 2021, 5:11 PM UTC

taylodl wrote: post #201

tadzik_ wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If $SPY dropped 40% we'd all call it a crash. This isn't that different If $SPY was 40% up since last month, would that be normal? ETH is still currently higher than its value from April 19th. Cryptocurrency market is extremely volatile. This isn't that far from normal.

> Cryptocurrency market is extremely volatile. This isn't that far from normal. If that's true then cryptocurrency is pretty much worthless to use as currency. A desired property of currency is to not have wild fluctuations in value on a weekly or monthly bases.

Crypto has a few stable coins

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#476

Post by abrahamepton » Wed, May 19, 2021, 5:11 PM UTC

pilingual wrote: post #451

Nursie wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I do not understand how every time cryptocurrency comes up armchair HN users come along and comment when they, very apparently, have almost no understanding of the topic This in itself is a meme - "All criticism is ignorance!" Bitcoin is not a ponzi or a pyramid scheme, that's true, but it has aspects of both, with its declining emission and stacked rewards for early adopters. And Bitcoin is for settlement now is i…

> This in itself is a meme - "All criticism is ignorance!" No, as I pointed out to the OP I was appreciative of his reasoned criticism because for years the top comments say things like, "Bitcoin is a ponzi; bitcoin is used only for illegal activity; Bitcoin failed." All wrong, and the only way I learned those were wrong was by understanding it and learning from smart people who are involved in the industry. > The tr…

There are serious, devastating critiques of Bitcoin. There are no serious rebuttals to those critiques, but plenty of people "involved in the industry" are making a lot of money from BTC, so it's no surprise they've convinced themselves it's fine. I guess they suckered you in too.

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#477

Post by [deleted] » Wed, May 19, 2021, 5:13 PM UTC

[deleted]

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#478

Post by mousepilot » Wed, May 19, 2021, 5:13 PM UTC

divs1210 wrote: post #454

pradn wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't seem like anyone believes cryptos are supposed to be currencies any more. All the talk around them is around them being a new, exciting, and potentially very lucrative investment class. If you go to Coinbase's front page, you see that you can buy and sell them, like you can with Robinhood. It's not trying to be a PayPal. The currency-ness does serve an important purpose. It helps bring in investment for th…

I have used crypto (LTC, BUSD, XLM, XMR) to pay internet strangers so many times I've lost count. Looks like you just haven't tried it yet.

yeah Ima have to update your file buddy

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#479

Post by okareaman » Wed, May 19, 2021, 5:14 PM UTC

Ologn wrote: post #417

pilingual wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for the disinterested take! It's refreshing to see this as a top comment when so often I see "Crypto makes me sick" which offers zero information and doesn't belong on HN. A few points to the repetitive comments I keep seeing: 1. Bitcoin is not a Ponzi scheme. Various cryptocurrencies operate in such a manner, but Bitcoin and Ethereum have value propositions: settlement and programmable money respectively.…

> A lot of smart people are invested in crypto: a16z, USV, Paradigm. These aren't greedy VCs -- it's their job to make returns for institutional investors who are often pension funds or charitable endowments, so if it a "Ponzi" then they are fools. (I wanted to say back in 1999) - a lot of smart people are invested in dot-com startups: Kleiner Perkins, Sequoia, Hummer Winblad. These aren't greedy VCs -- it's their jo…

The vibe is the same: I worked at dotcom pre-crash and the owner used to give noob internet investors (like the "Small Plane Pilots Association" or some such) a tour of the company and say something like "Look at all those people creating value on the internet! The internet is changing the world"

Re: Crypto crash deepens, stocks slip

#480

Post by thebean11 » Wed, May 19, 2021, 5:14 PM UTC

echelon wrote: post #418

thebean11 wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how can you possibly make the claim that BTC was diluted vs the market cap of other coins being net new value?

Opportunity cost and choice. Dogecoin means more to me than BTC. Good luck convincing me, or those that share my belief, otherwise If I put $500 into either, it'd be Doge.

That's fine, I don't think you have any evidence for your position though. You could easily make the opposite argument that Doge is basically a marketing campaign for BTC and will bring in more investment dollars than it sucks away. It's not zero sum.