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Elon Musk moves to Texas

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Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas

#471
post #95

It's unfortunate that Elon is leaving California given that the state has really lifted him to the pedestal he is on - through the talent network (highly talented employees, VCs), and the progressive policies that CA built for clean technology (Solar, EVs, Energy Storage). That was paid for on the backs of the people. Funny how short his memory is. Elon is a talented man - I absolutely respect what he's done. However…

If I'm not mistaken Texas has pursued large investments into clean energy, outranking California in terms of wind energy and adding solar at a very fast scale: https://www.forbes.com/sites/joshuarhodes/2020/09/25/even-re....

Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas

#472
post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, thank you! And so, what happened in Texas that "made an income tax unconstitutional"?

If you want a bit of reading: https://www.dallasnews.com/news/politics/2019/11/06/early-te...

In Washington's case, the Washington supreme court considered income tax inconstitutional as it would be double taxation as you were already taxed on property.

Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas

#473

I wish public rhetoric was less combative/twitter-like and more collaborative. Elon has built incredible companies doing incredible things. He's also made some stupid comments re: covid. SV political hostility towards technology companies and employees is frustrating. I wish the government was more aligned with helping these companies grow and things weren't treated as if they were so zero-sum (when they're not). I a…

I'm an optimist and forward looking person at heart. But the last couple of years have made me cynical enough that I researched the 'most free' country in the world as an expatriate destination[0].

We are witnessing super-wealthy individuals, I think the word is oligarch, use their out-sized wealth to advance causes outside of the domain that made them wealthy. Obvious examples include Bill Gates advancing world health, Mark Zuckerberg funding Freedom of Expression initiatives, and Soros' Open Society Foundations.

These initiatives can be impactful simply based on the resources supporting them. For example, LinkedIn reports 1,100 people currently working for Open Society Foundations. That number would require an annual budget in the realm of $200,000,000. The Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation shows 2,500 people working. Both Soros and Gates could easily fund those workforces out of their passive income.

Certainly, we've had relatively super-wealthy persons in the past. What's new is the reach that these current oligarchs can leverage. Their wealth is drawn from a global revenue, their workforces can easily travel globally, and they can promote their message globally using the Internet and Web, which have supplanted both the print and radio media that earlier oligarchs were confined to.

Whether or not you see this as a threat, my take is that I did not vote for Gates as world health oligarch or Soros as societal transformation oligarch, but they have taken those mantles on themselves. Whether for better or worse, I didn't have a say, but they can impose their initiatives on me. That bothers me.

[0] https://www.cato.org/human-freedom-index-new

Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas

#474

Earlier quoted context omitted.

California has a $54B deficit this year. It's been all over the news, including very left-wing sources like NY Times and Politico. The state _projected_ a surplus and was off by an entire order of magnitude into the red. The state has been campaigning to Congress all year for about $14B in bailout money.

> very left-wing sources like NY Times and Politico. Those are not very left-wing sources. Edit: to the downvoters, this is objectively true. In actual leftist media NYT is considered conservative. The reality is that they are mostly mainstream.

> In actual leftist media NYT is considered conservative. The reality is that they are mostly mainstream.

"Actual leftist"? Nice No true Scotsman you got there.

Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas

#475

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Better schools across all grades [citation needed] When I type “california public schools” into DuckDuckGo, the top suggestion is “california public schools bad.” Accepting this, the top three results are: ① “California schools were once the nation's envy. What went wrong?” > The enormous strike in Los Angeles paints a grim picture of wealthy state that is struggling to fund its education system https://www.theguar…

California funds schools mostly at the state level. Other states fund schools mostly at the local level. For wealthy people living in wealthy neighborhoods, local schools are therefore richer in states where they don’t also have to contribute to funding poor people’s kids’ educations. Here’s a clear summary I found describing education funding in CA https://ed100.org/lessons/whopays The local -> state change to the f…

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Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas

#476
post #158

Pretty interesting to see this move makes people so salty. There does seem to be a trend of people fleeing California, I dont know enough about the situation out there to comment on whether or not its valid. I suspect something must be going on for several high profile folks moving out. And before you bash Texas, its not perfect. But its pretty diverse, and it seems that folks with opposing viewpoints can still coexi…

Its just part of his naturalization package. Are you really American if you didn't non-consensually penetrate California's electrical grid and resources before doing an energy play in Texas?

Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas

#477

Earlier quoted context omitted.

California still has every viewpoint that is imaginable though there does seem to be less space for far right. What's making everyone salty about Elon leaving is there was considerable amount of people who helped him build up in the state (i.e. state benefits, staff who worked incredibly hard for many years, consumers who bought his cars [drive in the bay area]) and he's peacing out, with a slap in the face to everyo…

Genuine question: how do states like Texas, Florida, etc. get by without taxing income? Do they not need that money for their operations? What is the difference between their government and California's? I figure Florida makes it up with their tourism industry but Texas decidedly does not have that.

Oil is taxed quite a bit there, along with higher property taxes (some of the highest in the nation). But you'll also notice the roads aren't stellar, and many areas have issues with public education. Lack of state tax is reflected in all of this.

Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas

#478
post #136
post #6

California is actively looking for ways to extract more money from Elon. It likely posed an appreciable risk to his business ventures that CA at some point will try to tax unrecognized capital gains, which would require him to liquidate shares to pay the tax. Basically akin to a hostile government takeover. If CA were to aggressively pursue such a policy, they would likely go after anyone they perceived as fleeing ju…

> CA at some point will try to tax unrecognized capital gains Where is the evidence for this? Effectively, Elon has avoided future California capital gains taxes by moving. Those are the facts of his move. Personally, I would rather pay a few points extra on capital gains and income taxes to avoid Texas. Just look at what the Texas AG is doing right now: https://www.dallasnews.com/news/politics/2020/12/08/texas-ag...

Texas AG is just doing that to get a Presidential pardon.

It's pretty despicable that he is willing to throw the country under the bus for his own personal benefit.

Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas

#479
post #158

Pretty interesting to see this move makes people so salty. There does seem to be a trend of people fleeing California, I dont know enough about the situation out there to comment on whether or not its valid. I suspect something must be going on for several high profile folks moving out. And before you bash Texas, its not perfect. But its pretty diverse, and it seems that folks with opposing viewpoints can still coexi…

California has a ton of people moving here. That means there'll be some combination of population growth and people moving out. Of all my friends in SF, there are only five of us from here. When many of them move back out, it sounds like an exodus, but it's really just circulation.

Unless you are referring to specifically the covid moves, which are high cost of living minus geography mattering. It's anyone's guess whether it'll continue or reverse or what after covid.

Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas

#480

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're attributing too much credit to California. > Highly talented employees The vast majority of Tesla's "talented" employees came from out of state. Regardless of that, I don't understand the perspective that employment is an act of "taking from the state". Tesla pays above-market salaries. Isn't it, then, more accurate to view employment as Tesla giving back/helping to the community? > Progressive policie…

(1) Tesla actually used to pay below market rate (bay area) and had incredibly demanding working conditions (see drive from Elon carries through the company and that it was a mission based company) for a good period of time. I'm not saying thats good or bad just that they weren't paying above-market. Not sure what the calculus is now that the equity value has gone right off the charts. (2) No you get additional benef…

> No you get additional benefits for being in-state manufacturers. (I think its 10% vs 30% in state off capital costs).

Can you link me to a source that explains the additional benefits that in-state EV manufacturers accrue? Thanks!

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